Sentence Mining on Wanikani [please read full thread]

Hello hoomans of wanikani.
I created a script on python which enables me to speedily make flashcards from wanikani (kinda like migaku) - this addresses the requirements for an effective flashcard making process for me:
-enquire with mr gpt about grammar
-get an image from CONTEXT
-include audio

I like to mine from wanikani because I know words in the sentences : D

If you would like to see - you can try this video which I made, and if you like what you see, then you can follow my tutorial [in the same yt folder]. I hope this helps someone.

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I will come back later when I have more time to actually follow the details of your software and python code, but…

This is a bit off-topic, but I was wondering what software you were using for your video screen capture.

I wanted to do the whole thing where I advise against this and explain why, but actually your video gave a spot-on example of why you cannot rely on chatGPT for language questions

  • you asked ai a question
  • it confidently gave you an incorrect/incomplete answer
  • you even had it clarify
  • it continued its own incorrect/incomplete answer
  • you then made an anki card with it

AI doesn’t understand context and therefore relied on the primary meaning of どっち rather than the one that was actually correct for the question you asked

どっち for “who” comes from どちら様 (“who” but very polite)

One second search on jisho:

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Hey :waving_hand:

Thank you for taking the time to comment on my post, and using your expertise to critique.

I did not know of this issue with AI.

I understand what you mean by the implications of this, but because it is just a single sentence and the English translation is provided, I think improving the prompting, in addition to the model used, could result in better results (we are giving the context - need to include in prompt).

Also a confidence metric could also be very useful, as you said, the model giving confident answers that are wrong is not acceptable: D

What do you think ?

I used OBS on display capture mode : D

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Also friend, what way do you use to understand the grammar nuance, if not AI ?

For a specific sentence ? Perhaps asking native friends would be the best approach me thinks, but I’d be interested to hear what the best alternative is. Thank you

Made some changes to include a context block in the code with the English translation strictly followed to accommodate for the lack of context following of modern AI.

Changes propagated on github for anyone interested : D

Please try the new version if you are still interested : D

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LLMs are not AIs…
people need to think before blindly using tools like this… and trusting them …
STOP TAKING THE LAZY WAY OUT!!!

ANYTHING ELSE!!!
you are on the internet…have you tried posting questions to the Japanese Language section of the forums here?

have you thought about asking a native speaker FFS this one kills me soooo much - the internet you have access to natives… SHM … why people keep turning to AI garbage and assuming it knows all… LLMs are NOT AIs...write this on the board like bart simpson over and over until this sticks…

grammar nuance… have you tried bunpro? They don’t require paid membership for the most basic understanding and explanations…

Renshuu also has grammar (also free), free writing correction systems langcorrect… there are so many good free resouces that have native speakers involved…

Paid systems… marumori even! Online tutors…such as italki, cafe talk …
actual textbooks… Genki, Marugoto, Tobira…

Grammar dictionaries… there are 3 primary ones in this series…

**ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES AI CRAP!!! ** repeat this over and over…
When you finally learn enough to know what you are doing and when things are lying to you…then start using these tools and sanity check them…

since people are lazy and probably won’t do that either… ASK A NATIVE !!!

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Hello Shuly. Thank you for your comment.
I really appreciate the tools you have provided to me. I don’t mean to hate on these methods, as I do think they are awesome sauce, but I really enjoy making nice solutions to personal problems I have and making things more efficient.

The purpose of this script is not to give me the full rundown of grammatical patterns, but I just want to understand how each part of the sentence functions, then after repeated exposure, I will be able to use them.

I don’t like studying grammar singularly, and I dont want to spend a long time on one sentence, which is why I created this.

But you do make a very valid point about using AI which replaces people. I plan to use this system until I will write my own Japanese stories for example, and get native feedback.

All of this has confirmed to me though that LLM’s are very very poor at translation, so I will 10000% use native help (where I can make friends too !), but for this pattern repeat, structured format where I can serve the context, I think it is a nice addition to my system (but not a replacement). So thank you for helping me to see this.

It would be comedic irony if it weren’t simultaneously deeply concerning that you are promoting a tool well-known to be incorrect an overwhelming amount of the time. Dictionaries have started adding a sub-definition under the word “hallucination” to describe the type of answers AI and LLMs give users because it’s such a widespread issue.

You are posting on a forum meant for nuance questions, please feel free to jump into the threads and engage with native content alongside other learners of all levels. I also like to reference Bunpro.jp for grammar, which is continually updated by both native speakers and advanced learners.

Based on this information, you are setting yourself up to fail. You will be memorizing incorrect answers without being able to detect that they are wrong.

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confabulous
:relieved_face:

just wanted to use this fun word hehe

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Thank you for your comment and resources.
I really appreciate your help.

In the new patch I did my best to serve the sentence English expected sentence very clearly - and have a very low metric for making up new ideas, keeping within the context provided very strictly, and continually asking for clarification / tests.

I dont suggest that this is a replacement for reasoning, but it serves as a handy tool integrated with hooman reasoning to make it work - starting from a ‘I think this part suggests x, what do you think’ viewpoint and expanding from there, and having a preconception to be critical about the response, is what makes it useful, me thinks.

May this thread serve as a warning for people wanting to try it out, of the known issues with the tech. Because I am now aware, I can be careful (me thinks). I like where it is at now, and I take upon any burden this causes me in the future.

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JP: せっかく二人のためにオーダーしたケーキなのに、なんで一人でたべちゃったの?
EN: Why did you eat it alone when I ordered a cake for the two of us?

AI: Let’s discuss this sentence: 「せっかく二人のためにオーダーしたケーキなのに、なんで一人で たべちゃったの?」. What would you like to explore first?

Commands: /anki | /skip | /image

You: Dang this is a hard sentence - sekkaku ? na no empahsising and ni indicating purpose

AI: The Japanese sentence is in a casual register.

Here is the mapping of the Japanese sentence to the provided English sentence:

  1. 「せっかく」 → No direct English substring; relates to overall meaning. — Emphasizes the effort or special occasion, implied in the context of ordering a cake.
  2. 「二人のために」 → “for the two of us” — Indicates the purpose of ordering the cake.
  3. 「オーダーした」 → “ordered” — Describes the action of ordering the cake.
  4. 「ケーキ」 → “a cake” — Refers to the cake that was ordered.
  5. 「なのに」 → “when” — Indicates a contrast or unexpected situation, connecting the two parts of the sentence.
  6. 「なんで」 → “Why” — Asks for the reason or explanation.
  7. 「一人で」 → “alone” — Describes the action of eating by oneself.
  8. 「たべちゃったの」 → “did you eat it” — Refers to the action of eating the cake.

Does this mapping match your intention?

You: other example wih sekkaku ?

AI: Certainly! Here’s another example using 「せっかく」:

JAPANESE SENTENCE: せっかく作った料理を誰も食べなかった。
ENGLISH SENTENCE: No one ate the meal I went to the trouble of making.

Mapping:

  1. 「せっかく」 → “went to the trouble of” — Emphasizes the effort put into making the meal.
  2. 「作った」 → “making” — Describes the action of preparing the meal.
  3. 「料理」 → “the meal” — Refers to the food that was prepared.
  4. 「を」 → No direct English substring; relates to overall meaning. — Marks the direct object in Japanese.
  5. 「誰も」 → “No one” — Indicates that nobody ate the meal.
  6. 「食べなかった」 → “ate” — Describes the action of eating, negated in Japanese to indicate it didn’t happen.

Does this mapping match your intention?

You: yes. What about this tabechatta form ?

AI: The form 「たべちゃった」 is a casual contraction of 「たべてしまった」, which indicates the completion of an action, often with a sense of regret or unintended consequence.

In the provided English sentence, “did you eat it” corresponds to this form, capturing the action of eating the cake.

Does this explanation match your intention?

You: woah. cool

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Here it can be seen that because it works within the context provided, very strictly - breaking down the component parts first to the best of its ability without bias helps to avoid illusions because I prompted the agent to very specifically use the english sentence paired up with the jp sentence, creating a type of bond which keeps the answer relevant, and contextually meaningful.

Example #2 - using it as a kind of internal monalogue to encode knowledge rather than get automatic breakdowns and working with the AI ‘i.e. I think x’ to help make compariosons and build knowledge

AI: Certainly! Here’s a bit more detail on the mapping for 「二ゲームとも」:

  1. 「二ゲームとも」:
    • 「二」 means “two.”
    • 「ゲーム」 means “games.”
    • 「とも」 is a particle that means “both” or “together,” indicating that the action applies to all items mentioned (in this case, both games).

So, 「二ゲームとも」 collectively translates to “in both games,” as it refers to the action happening in both of the games mentioned.

Does this mapping match your intention?
You: I feel like isshou is used moreso for togetherness and tomo is used more for ‘both’

AI: Yes, you’re correct in noting the nuances. In this context, 「とも」 is used to indicate “both” in the sense of including all items mentioned, which are the two games. It emphasizes that the action applies to both games collectively.

Does this mapping match your intention?

You: yes

AI: Great! If you have any more questions or need further clarification, feel free to ask.

You: /anki

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Example 3 - AI strictly follows context window for responses, even when I suggest something else - it speaks less with the user, and more with the sentence… kind of like it is speaking at itself in some internal monologue, and we are the observer. I think this helps to avoid hallucination → it is confident in a good way, because the context has been provided.

You: ayo

AI: REGISTER/FORMALITY: Neutral

  1. 「来週」 → “next week” — This directly corresponds to the time frame mentioned in the English sentence.
  2. 「初級」 → “beginner level class” — “初級” means “beginner level,” which matches the English phrase.
  3. 「から」 → “from” — Indicates the starting point or origin, matching “from” in the English sentence.
  4. 「中級」 → “intermediate level class” — “中級” means “intermediate level,” which matches the English phrase.
  5. 「に」 → No direct English substring; relates to overall meaning. — Indicates direction or target, implied in the transition.
  6. 「レベルが上がります」 → “I’m moving to the intermediate level class” — This phrase means “level goes up,” which corresponds to the action of moving to a higher level in the English sentence.

Does this mapping match your intention?

You: I swear kara meant ‘until’ doe ?

AI: In this context, 「から」 means “from,” indicating the starting point of a transition. It is used to show the origin or starting point, as in moving from one level to another.

Does this mapping match your intention?

You:

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I 1000000% agree that the AI is flawed, but my argument is that if we can carefully navigate this situation by helping it out, and enforcing strict rules that aknowledge the flaws, then we can create a useful tool.

imo, you should spend sufficient time on a sentence, especially when starting to read. Then try to explain or translate in your own words, then let people check.

If natives or teachers are too difficult to reach out, that’s what forum is for. For this community particularly, Japanese Language > Grammar or just these threads – Short Grammar Questions (Part 2) and The quick or short Language Questions Thread (not grammar) – but don’t hesitate if you feel a need to open a new thread.

I’d also recommend hiding English translation. That’s not your own comprehension.

At least, I am sure that taking time to comprehend by yourself matters for leaps in comprehension.


Another thing is sentences on WaniKani, even at low levels, aren’t necessarily the easiest. Low levels somewhere else – Tadoku or Natively – may be easier.

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Thank you for taking the time to comment and sharing these resources with me : 3

I will definitely need to supplement my learning with native reading then. I see how reading without the translation would also be mega important.

I will make sure to do so, thank you :slightly_smiling_face: