[aDoBJG] T 💮 A Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar

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A Dictionary of Japanese Grammar :white_flower: Home Thread

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Week
Start Date
Reading Entry Count Page Numbers Page Count
#26 Sep 16th 達 to 〜たらどうですか 6 440 - 458 19
#27 Sep 23rd 〜たり 〜たりする to ず1 6 458 - 476 19
#28 Sep 30th ず2 to 時 7 476 - 494 19
#29 Oct 7th ずころだ1 to っお 7 495 - 511 17

Links are to the official starting of each week. Previous weeks and future weeks can still be discussed before and after these points as long as they are covered by the thread’s letters.

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2 Likes

It’s kind of weird that you can say 圌女達 but not 圌達 

5 Likes

Random request. I’ve just got to tamaranai (sorry no jp keyboard on my phone and I’m typing in a moving car) and the main page is missing. It’s p446. Any chance someone could post this single page?

4 Likes

Sure :slight_smile:
Hope the quality turns out okay.

Page 446

5 Likes

New week is here, week 27, 〜たり 〜たりする to ず1, 6 entries.

8 Likes

Week 28 is here, ず2 to 時, 7 entries.

8 Likes

I had been looking forward to ず for a while, I felt like it’s a grammar point that there is a lot to say about. It was simpler than I expected!

4 Likes

Let me see if I can remember my notes I made for this part.

  • for たい and ほしい I can recommend lesson #29 of Visualizing Japanese Grammar, which always has a small quiz for each lesson.
  • looks at the 5+ pages about たら and has flashback about learning about the if-clause in English class
  • actually a lot of grammar points here are somewhat similar in meaning to “if / when”. And because there are so many options there is a lot of nuance. Anothother reason why I do not like google translate or other such systems, they never take the nuance into account.
  • speaking of nuance, ずいう is talked about twice; once as ず³ + いう and once as ずいう. I myself would count them as one grammar point because ず³ already covers indirect quotation, but maybe someone has a different opinion (and isn’t the author)
  • -っお: as it is a colloquialism I will probably not be able to remember this :sweat_smile: At least I know where to look up it’s meaning when I come across it
7 Likes

I already knew the quotation usage for ず、but using it for “with the sound of/in the manner of” was one I never noticed before! Now I need to learn more phono-pheno-psychomimes so I can use them.

Also learned what the words phonomime, phenomime, and psychomime mean. Bonus. :+1:

6 Likes

Week 29 is here, ずころだ1 to っお, 7 entries.

6 Likes

Made it to the T’s finally!

達

Does anyone know why that is? I don’t think I’d heard this before now, but now I’m curious, haha.

I don’t think I’ve encountered 共 or 方 as pluralizing suffixes much in the stuff that I read/listen to. I thought it was interesting about 子䟛 no longer being used as a plural (and instead 子䟛達 is the plural). I think I have seen 方々, but only in a textbook, haha.

This says that ら is the least formal plural marker, and it’s normally attached to personal pronouns and names. I’m actually not sure I’ve seen it written in kanji before? Typing it with my IME seems to support my assumption that 僕ら, for example, is more common than 僕等.

My main comment on this is that it sometimes creates minor translation issues for me haha because someone saying “[their name]達” for “we” comes across as a little self-centered in a way that can be hard to convey without making the sentence clunky. Sometimes I’ll just give up and translate it as “we”, but if the wrestler is specifically focusing on themself, I usually try to find a way to keep it.

Here's one example from Tokyo Joshi Pro Wrestling's show on 2023.09.09, after the 3-way tag match to determine which tag team would be challenging for the vacated tag titles at Wrestle Princess on October 9:

Hard mode: here’s the video. Usual disclaimer that the transcript is from shupro and might be flawed, and the translation is mine and may contain errors.

ぜむ「ああああああああああ 負けた」

Pom: “AAAAAHHHHHH! I lost!”

らく「うるさいから」

Raku: "Because you’re too loud.”

ぜむ「うるさいから ああああああああああ」

Pom: “I’m too loud? AAAAAHHHHHH!”

らく「今日は広島くる時にこの3WAYの詊合を倢で芋たんですよ。で、勝ったんですよ。だから満足しお、もう垰ろうかっお思っお起きたら 」

Raku: “When we were coming to Hiroshima, I saw this 3-way match in a dream. And we won. So I was satisfied, and just as I thought ‘well I guess I’ll go home,’ I woke up.”

ぜむ「広島に着いおたね」

Pom: “We’d arrived in Hiroshima.”

らく「ただ着いおなかった。 あれ 埅っお」

Raku: “No. Or
? Wait
”

ぜむ「正倢でしたね」

Pom: “The dream became reality, huh?”

らく「正倢だったね」

Raku: “The dream became reality.”

ぜむ「ちょっず、じゃあ どうする 倢の䞭に垰りたすか やっぱ勝ちたいもんね」

Pom: “Hey, then
 what do we do? Should we go back inside the dream? We still want to win, right?”

らく「そうだね」

Raku: “Yes.”

ぜむ「ぜむたちが勝っおるずこ行こう。らくずぜむは倢の䞭にいきたすので、おやすみ」

Pom: “Let’s go to the place where Pom and friends are winning. Raku and Pom are going into the dream, so oyasumi.”

らく「゚クスプレス」

Raku: “Express~”

ぜむ「倢で䌚おうね」

Pom: “Let’s meet up in your dreams.”

らく「おやすみなさい。よい倢を」

Raku: “Goodnight. Sweet dreams.”

In this, I felt like it was important to preserve the emphasis on Pom (+ others), because Pom loses very, very frequently, so translating it as “the place where we win” would lose some of the centering around her own experience.

たい

According to the notes, たい expresses a very personal feeling, so it’s usually used only for the first person in declarative sentences and for the second person in interrogative sentences. But it’s acceptible in these situations: in the past tense, in indirect/semi-direct speech, in explanatory situations, and in conjecture expressions.

If the verb is a transitive verb, the direct object can be marked either by が or を, with the choice depending on degree of desire. When the desire to do something is high, が is used, and when it’s low, を is used. But が can’t be used when a long element intervenes between the direct object and the verb, when the main verb is in the passive form, or when the preceding noun is not the direct object (looking at the two examples, it’s basically saying that when the を is を2-4 and not を1). In the construction Vたす たがっおいる, が can never be used to mark the direct object.

たい can’t be used to express an invitation! In these situations, negative questions are used. I think the distinction between たい and the ほしいs has been covered earlier in this thread and also probably discussed back in the H’s, haha.

Here are a bunch of examples in a long post-match comment I just translated from TJPW's 2023.11.05 show, which was in new rookie Shino Suzuki's hometown:

Hard mode: here’s the video.

志乃「地元凱旋、ありがずうございたした。デビュヌしお1幎もたたずしおこの生たれ育った街に垰っおこれお嬉しく思いたす。ありがずうございたす。アむドルになりたいずいう倢を叶えるために静岡から出おきたんですけど、倢を叶え始めちゃっお、出おきた静岡にこうやっお垰れたこずをすごく嬉しいなず思いたす。今、自分はプロレスで䜕か成し遂げおいるこずはたったくないんですね。1回も勝ったこずないし。だけど今床は䜕かを成し遂げお胞を匵っお垰っおきたいなずいう新しい目暙ができお、これが䜕か次に぀ながる倧䌚になれたらいいなず思いたした。未詩さんずシングルだったんですけど、今日は地元凱旋で気持ちが匷いずいうか熱い思いで今日は臚んで。ねくじぇねトヌナメントが次の倧䌚になるんですね。未詩さんはずっずゞムで䞀緒にいる、緎習も䞀緒にいる。未詩さんが嫌だず思っおも私が目に入っおくるず思うんです。だから私のこずをすごく知っおくれおいるんですね、デビュヌ前からずっずゞムで䌚っお色んな話を聞いおくれお。未詩さんずシングルできたり、次はトヌナメントあるっお時に倧切な節目・節目に未詩さんが必ずいるなっお思っおお。だから今日闘えたこずは、痛いし、パワヌも匷いし、そういうずころは自分はただただだず思ったけど、闘えたこずをすごくすごく嬉しく思いたす。未詩さんにずっおはすごく䞖話の焌ける埌茩だず思うんですけど、い぀かは闘っお楜しかったず蚀っおもらえるように匷くなりたいですし、未詩さんがいっぱい色んなこずを教えおくれおいるからこそ、匷くなった姿でい぀か感謝や成長を未詩さんに芋せたいなず思いたした。

Shino: “Thank you for the show in my hometown. I’m happy to come back to the town where I was born and raised less than a year after my debut. Thank you so much! I left Shizuoka to fulfill my dream of becoming an idol, but now that I’ve started to achieve my dream, I’m so happy to be able to return to my hometown like this. I’ve yet to accomplish anything at all in pro wrestling. I’ve never won a single match. But now I have a new goal, which is to achieve something and come back home with my heart held high, and I hope that this show will lead to whatever is next for me. I had a singles match with Miu-san, and I went into it with strong feelings, with passion for performing in front of my hometown. The (Next Generation) tournament match is next. Miu-san is always with me at the gym, and we practice together, too. Even if she doesn’t want to, she can’t help but see me. That’s why she knows me so well. We’ve been meeting at the gym and she’s been listening to me talk about all sorts of things since before my debut. Having a singles match with Miu-san, and with the tournament coming up, I know that Miu-san will be there at every major turning point for me. So even though it was painful, and even though she was strong, and it made me realize how far I still have left to go, I’m so happy that I was able to fight her today. I think I’m an annoying junior from Miu-san’s perspective, but I want to become strong enough that someday she’ll say it was fun to fight me. Because Miu-san has taught me so many things, I want to show her my gratitude and show my growth by showing her how much stronger I’ve gotten.”

い぀もに増しお勝ちぞの執念を芋せたず思うが静岡凱旋で今日家族も芋おくれたり、私をすごく応揎しおくれおいる方からい぀もに増しお『頑匵れ』ずいうパワヌを感じたので、未詩さんずいう盞手はキャリアもパワヌも、圧倒的に私より遥か䞊をいくけど、こうやっお応揎を力に負けたくないなずいう気持ちがやっぱあった。応揎も倍に感じたので、私の負けたくない気持ちも倍になっお、今日は匷い盞手でしたけど、諊めずに闘いきれたかなず思っおたす。この詊合が自力初勝利やトヌナメントに぀ながるず思う本圓に今日の詊合は必死過ぎお蚘憶にないぐらいではあったんですけど、未詩さんず闘えたこずがすごく倧きいんですよ。熱く『向かっお来い』ずどしんず構えおおくれたから、私もい぀も以䞊のパワヌの出し方じゃないですけど、自分のリミッタヌが倖れる感じの執念で闘えお。こういう闘い方っおあたり自分でも出そうず思っお出せないじゃないですか。そういう自分の気持ちを党面に出させおくれたのは未詩さんだったので、この気持ちの出し方や勝ちぞの執念の出し方を孊んだので、それでトヌナメントに向かいたいなず思いたした。次闘うHIMAWARIさんもパワヌタむプなので、今日闘えたこずに意味があるなず思いたす。第2回目はやりたいもちろん。次に぀ながる倧䌚にしたいのでやりたいず思うし、東京女子が静岡垂初䞊陞ずいうこずだったので、もっず静岡垂に東京女子の名前がこの1幎で広たればいいなず思うし、自分も䜕かを成し遂げお胞を匵っお垰りたいので次もあるずいいなず思いたす」

(I think you showed even more of a determination to win than usual)

“Since I was returning to my hometown, my family were there to watch me, and I felt that ‘ganbare!’ power from the people cheering for me even more than usual. Miu-san is so far above me both in terms of career and power, but with everyone’s support, I really felt that I didn’t want to lose. I felt double the support, so my desire not to lose was doubled in turn, and even though I was facing a strong opponent, I think I was able to fight without giving up.”

(Do you think this match will lead to your first win, or a tournament victory?)

“I felt so desperate in today’s match that I don’t even remember it, but getting to fight Miu-san was huge. She was fired up and her stance said ‘come at me!’, so I was able to fight with a lot of determination, not in a way that I brought out more power than usual, but in the sense that my limiter was off. This style of fighting, I can’t show it very well even if I intend to. It was Miu-san who pushed me to show all of my feelings on the surface, and I learned how to show my feelings and my determination to win, so that’s how I want to approach the tournament. My next opponent, HIMAWARI, is also a power type fighter, so I think it’s significant that I was able to fight someone like that today.”

(Do you want to do this a second time?)

“Of course! I want to make this the kind of show that leads to another one. This was (TJPW’s) first time in Shizuoka City, so I hope the name of TJPW spreads in Shizuoka City over the next year, and I want to achieve something and come back home with my heart held high. So I hope there’s another one.”

たたらない

I didn’t recognize this one, so I don’t think I’ve formally learned about it before! The notes describe it as an idiomatic phrase used to express the fact that some situation is unbearable in the extreme for the speaker or someone with whom they emphasize. The adjectives before お/で refer to human feelings. Also, there is no affirmative counterpart of this construction (お/で たたる doesn’t exist).

The related expressions note says that おたたらない can be replaced by お仕方がない. The only difference is the former is more emotive than the latter. But when お仕方がない is preceded by Vおも, it cannot be replaced by たたらない.

I searched my translation documents, thinking that maybe I'd never seen this one, but I did in fact find one example! This was from one of the vaguely early translations I did, after Suzume faced Miu Watanabe on 2022.09.16 to see which of them would earn the right to challenge for the International Princess Championship.

Hard mode: here’s the video:

鈎芜「あたり泣いおいる姿は芋せないず思うがけっこう泣き虫かも苊笑。普段ず違うように感じたしたでも、い぀も悔しくお悔しくおっおいうのはもちろんあるんですけど 今日はなんだろう。党郚出し切った解攟感みたいなのもちょっずありたす。充実感ずいうか。でも悔しくおたたらないです。この倏の成長や期埅はどう受け止めおいるこの倏に向けおずか、倏にやったこずは決しお無駄じゃなくお。でもそれでも、ただただ足りないものだらけなので。未詩さんをはじめずした先茩たちに負けないように。危険な存圚になっおいきたいず思いたす。その足りないものは芋぀かった感芚はあるでも、自分の闘い方は間違っおないずいうか。未詩さん盞手でも今日闘えたず信じおるので。この道を突き進むっおかんじです」

(I don’t think we’ve ever seen you cry this much)

Suzume: “I can be quite a crybaby.” (laughs)

(It felt different from usual)

“I always feel frustrated and disappointed, of course, but
 what is it about today? Going out there and doing my best, it feels kind of freeing, or I guess fulfilling. But I can’t help but feel frustrated.”

(How do you feel about your growth and all of the expectations this summer?)

“Everything I did going into summer, and during summer, it wasn’t in vain. But even so, it wasn’t enough, in so many ways. I want to have a dangerous presence so that I don’t lose to my senpais, starting with Miu-san.”

(Do you feel like you’ve discovered what you’re lacking?)

“I don’t think my fighting style is wrong. I believe I was able to fight today even with Miu-san as my opponent, so I’m going to keep moving forward along this path.”

ために

I feel like I thought after I initially learned this that I’d have more trouble getting the different meanings confused, but I can’t recall it ever being a problem in actual practice, haha.

As the notes explain, ために expresses cause or reason when it is preceded by an Adj(い) or an Adj(な), or when the main clause describes a noncontrollable situation and/or when the ために clause is in the past tense. In these cases, it never expresses purpose. The に can be dropped if a phrase(s) intervenes between the main verb and ために.

The related expressions note points out that when ため is used to mean reason or cause, it can be replaced by から or ので. The difference is that ため is more formal than the others and is seldom used in informal conversation, which I suppose explains why I can’t recall having seen this terribly much in my wrestling translations, haha.

When ため is used to mean purpose, it can be replaced by either Vinf-nonpast のに or Vたす に Vmotion. However, ために can be replaced by のに only when one does something in the process of achieving some goal, and it can only be replaced by Vたす に Vmotion when ため is used with a motion. Just like the other note, the difference between ため and other markers of purpose is that ため is the most formal and least colloquial of the three.

Here's an example from the TJPW press conference on 2023.10.04 before Mahiro Kiryu and Yuki Kamifuku faced Nao Kakuta and Hikari Noa for the tag titles at Wrestle Princess:

The video for this is long as heck, so I won’t bother linking it, but here’s a link to the full transcript for the press conference.

真匥「私もデビュヌしおからベルトに挑戊するこずはあれど、䞀床もベルトを取ったこずがないので。プロレスラヌになったからにはベルトずいうものを持っおみたいずいう気持ちもありたすし。で、ベルトを持ったからこその䜿呜感、責任感みたいなもの ただ未知の䞖界なんですけど。そういうものを感じお、もっずもっずプロレスラヌずしお成長しおいきたいっおいう気持ちがあっお。そのためにベルトを獲りたいですね チャンスを今掎んでいるず思っおいるので。勢いよく飛び出したいず思いたす」

Mahiro: “Since my debut, I’ve challenged for that belt, but I’ve never won it. Since becoming a professional wrestler, I’ve felt that desire to have a belt. After getting a belt, that sense of purpose, that sense of responsibility
 that’s still an unknown world to me. I want to feel what that’s like, and I want to grow even more as a pro wrestler. That is why I want to win the belt! Because I think that now I have a chance. I want to burst out with momentum.”

たら

I’ve had a bit of trouble getting the if/when confused with this one, but mainly in translating it, I think. Sometimes it’s not entirely clear which it is from the Japanese alone


As note 1 says, S1 always represents an antecedent and S2 a subsequence. However, the problems (for me) come from what note 2 has, which is that in S1 たら S2, it is often the case that S1 represents a condition and S2 an event which occurs under that condition. So the whole sentence basically means “when S1 is satisfied, S2 takes place”, or “S1 brings about S2”.

たら means “when” if S1 is a certainty; if not, たら means “if”. もし before S1 たら makes sentences unambiguous because it always means “if S1”.

S2 can be a command, a request, a suggestion, an invitation, or a volitional sentence. S1 たら S2 can also be used in counterfactual situations.

When S2 represents a past action, the action cannot be one intentionally taken by the agent after the action or event represented by S1. I don’t think I knew this about it?

Lots of related expressions for this! In S1 たら S2, if the event in S1 precedes the event in S2, those events can be past events. This is also the case with S1 ず4 S2, but not with S1 ば S2 and S1 なら S2.

With S1 たら S2, S1 ば S2, and S1 なら S2, S2 can be a command, a request, a suggestion, an invitation, or a volitional sentence, though it can’t be with S1 ず S2. However, in all three of those cases, the meaning is a bit different.

S1 たら S2, S1 ば S2, and S1 なら S2 can all be used in counterfactual situations, but S1 ず S2 can’t be used in such situations except for the idiomatic expression S ず いい/よかった.

There are a billion たらs in my TJPW translations, but here's a recent-ish example from their 2023.10.27 show, after the six 2023 rookies had a tag match previewing the rookie tournament that was about to start. Can you figure out if this is an "if" or a "when"?

Hard mode: here’s the video.

凍雅「負けちゃったけどねくじぇねトヌナメントの前哚戊みたいな感じなので、ハルは1回戊で圓たるHIMAWARIさんに負けちゃったけど 」

Toga: “We lost, but since it was like a preview match for the Next Generation tournament, (Haru) lost to HIMAWARI-san, who she’ll be facing in the first round
”

ハル「HIMAWARIさんに今日盎接取られおしたったけど、次は負けないので」

Haru: “I lost directly to HIMWAWARI-san today, but I’m not gonna lose next time.”

志乃「ハルが負けないで䞊がっおきたら私になるんですけど、自力で勝ったこずないし、みんな今日の詊合で䞀番目立っおやるずか、勢い぀けおやるずかいう意気蟌みをしおいたし、今日は痛いほどそれを感じたした。自分は今眮いおいかれおいるけど、今日の詊合でもう眮いおいかれないぞず決めたので。私は眮いおいかれないで駆け抜けお優勝したいず思いたす。諊めないです。匱いず思っおんな。ここから匷いのを芋せ぀けたいず思いたす」

Shino: “If Haru doesn’t lose and goes on to the next round, she’ll be facing me. I’ve never won (on my own) before, and everyone was driven to stand out the most in today’s match, and I felt that so strongly today that it hurt. Right now, everyone’s getting ahead of me, but after today’s match, I decided that I’m not going to be left behind anymore. I’m not going to be left behind, and I’m going to catch up and get past everyone and win the tournament. I won’t give up. Don’t think I’m weak. From here, I’m going to show that I’m strong.”

たらどうですか

Short entry for this! I don’t think I have much to comment on, either. I did think it was interesting that this is an idiomatic phrase derived from the S1 たら S2 construction, expressing a suggestion.

The informal version is Vinf-past らどう, and more polite versions are Vinf-past らどうでしょう(か), Vinf-past らいかがですか, and Vinf-past らいかがでしょう(か). I don’t think I’ve seen a single one of these in TJPW, haha.

The related expressions note says that ほうがいい also expresses suggestion, but this phrase is close to a command (especially when it is preceded by Vinf-past), and so it is therefore stronger than たらどうですか.

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たりたりする

Something worth noting with this is that this construction generally expresses an inexhaustive listing of actions or states (meaning that in a given situation there may be additional unstated actions or states). Compare with the お-form, which expresses an exhaustive listing of actions or states.

Note 2 tells us that する usually follows Xたり Yたり regardless of the part of speech of X and Y, and expresses the tense, the aspect (e.g., progressive, perfect) and the formality level of the sentence.

I had to look these up: “progressive tense” is a category of verb tense that describes ongoing actions (sometimes called “continuous” tense, which I had heard of before with Japanese). “Perfect tense” is used to show an action that is complete and finished, or perfected (in English, it’s expressed by adding an auxiliary verb, have, has, or had, to the past participle form of the main verb).

Note 3 tells us that this construction usually lists two actions or two states, but it can list more than two, or only one. Also, if it’s not the final segment of a sentence and the predicate is an adjective, する may be omitted, but it can’t be omitted if the predicate is a verb.

Also, a slightly different pattern Xたり Yたり だ is also used in some situations, namely when a speaker describes someone’s or something’s inconstant state.

Honestly, I feel like I rarely see this straightforwardly used to list two actions, haha. TJPW wrestlers often used it to list inexhaustive actions or traits but only actually specify one thing.

Here's an example from TJPW's 2023.11.03 show, where rookie Toga faced her fellow rookie Runa Okubo in the first round of the Next Generation tournament:

Hard mode: here’s the video.

凍雅「たず初戊、琉那ずの詊合。初めおシングルやっお、正盎琉那もパワヌタむプだったりしお、あず゚ルボヌ匷かったりするので負けたくないなっお気持ちはあっお。でも なんずか初戊突砎できお、次はわかなさんですね。1回シングルしたこずがあっお、䞞め蟌みで負けちゃっおお。その時すごい悔しかったし、ただ私も力をすべお発揮する前に負けちゃったっおいうのもあっお。だから次の準決勝はもちろん党郚出し切っお、その䞊で決勝たで進出できたらなっお思いたす。巊ブロックは初戊、HIMAWARIさんが勝っお、次は志乃さんずで。どっちが勝っおくるか分かんないけど、私はもちろん決勝にいく぀もりなので。どっちがきおも優勝したいず思いたす」

Toga: “To start with, my first match was against Runa. It was our first singles match, and to be honest, Runa’s also a power type, and her elbow strikes are really strong, so I really didn’t want to lose. I managed to get past the first round, and I have Wakana-san next. We’ve had one singles match, but I lost to a roll-up. I was really disappointed then, and I felt that I’d lost before I was able to show my full strength. So of course I’m going to put my all into the semifinal next, and I really hope to make it to the final. In the left block, HIMAWARI-san won, and her next match is with Shino-san. I don’t know which of them is going to win, but of course I intend to reach the finals. I’m going to win no matter who comes forward.”

たっお

I don’t think I’ve formally learned this one before anywhere! I can’t recall any examples of seeing it while translating TJPW either, though I could’ve easily forgotten haha. I’m not going to include an example because I tried searching for it and found a lot of other っお uses that aren’t this.

According to note 1, たっお is used strictly in informal spoken Japanese, and is used to indicate something counter to fact, though the counterfactual (or subjunctive) nature of this construction is not very strong. (Subjunctive is a mood of verbs expressing what is imagined or wished or possible).

たっお can take どんなに meaning “no matter how”.

The related expressions note tells us that it can be replaced by おも, with the difference being that おも can be used in spoken and written language and that it is less emotive than たっお.

お

I feel like learning the お-form is sort of the first major test for beginners, haha. It definitely was one of those things I only sort of grasped at first


As the notes describe, the お-form functions, in part, to link sentences. So if the last element of the predicate of a clause is the お-form, it means that that clause is not the end of the sentence and that another predicate or clause follows it.

The meaning varies according to context, but generally it corresponds to “and” or “-ing” in participial constructions. When it links two predicates, the relationship between the two can be a number of possibilities: they can occur sequentially, they can be two states of someone or something, the first can be the reason for or the cause for the second, the first can be the means by which someone does the second or the manner in which someone does it, the first can be contrasted with the second, or the second predicate can be unexpected in terms of the first.

That last one took me a bit to wrap my head around, though the dictionary’s example makes it clearer, I think.

The お-form can be repeated more than once in a clause, and just like the ず1 particle makes an exhaustive listing of nouns, the お-form can list verbs and adjectives exhaustively (as mentioned in the previous entry! For once reading this dictionary in sequential order pays off!).

お-form verbs are also used with expressions as いる, から, and はいけない.

I wasn’t going to include any examples, but there’s one sense of this in particular that took me a while to wrap my head around, which is how the お-form is often used to describe emotional reactions to things (it gives the information in a different order than we’re used to in English!).

Here's an example from TJPW's 2023.11.19 show, which featured a couple more matches in the Next Generation tournament, including this one between Toga and Wakana Uehara:

Hard mode: here’s the video.

䞊原「ねくじぇねトヌナメントの準決勝戊で凍雅ずシングルだったんですけど、凍雅は普段の緎習からも䞀番近くにいるし、䞀緒にいる時間も倚いからこそ、盞手の努力しおいる姿も芋おきたし、匷さもわかっおいた分、今日は闘うたでちょっず怖かったんですけど、実際にリングに䞊がっおみたら決勝に進むしかないずいう気持ちしかなかったし、こうやっお勝おお嬉しいです。でももうすぐに12月1日の埌楜園ホヌルではねくじぇねトヌナメントの決勝戊、HIMAWARIさんず察戊する。デビュヌ日も䞀緒ずいうこずで、やっぱり呚りの方からも比べられるこずがすごい倚い2人なので、䟡倀ある第1回目ずいうなかなかないチャンスなので優勝をしっかり掎みに党力で闘いたいず思いたす」

Uehara: “I had a singles match with Toga in the semifinals of the Next Generation Tournament. I’m closest to Toga thanks to training with her regularly, and since we spend so much time together, I have seen how hard my opponent works and how strong she is, so I was a bit scared leading up to the match today. But as soon as I stepped into the ring, I felt like I had no choice but to advance to the finals, so I’m happy that I was able to win here. But I’ll be facing HIMAWARI-san very soon in the Next Generation Tournament final at the Korakuen Hall show on December 1. Since we debuted on the same day, people around us often compare us, so the first ever tournament is a valuable opportunity that doesn’t come around often, and I’m going to seize that chance and fight her with everything I have.”

おも

Something kind of funny to me is that example e is technically an example for the next grammar point (hang on, wait a minute, it’s literally almost identical to the key sentence that’s used for the next point)
 Note 2 also talks about it, so I wonder if they wrote this entry before deciding to make a separate one for おもいい?

Kind of surprised they don’t have a separate entry for the WH-word おも use, either.

The related expressions notes point out that おも is comparable but not identical to けれど “although” and のに “in spite of the fact that”. The semantic difference is the same as the difference between “even if” vs “although” in English. However, if おも is used with a WH-word, it can’t be replaced by けれど or のに.

I think this one is generally pretty straightforward, so I’m going to give an example where it’s not, haha! I unwittingly ran into an age-old translation problem when translating TJPW recently


Do these translations look familiar to anyone?


Here's an example with the line in Japanese from TJPW's 2023.11.19 show after Shoko Nakajima faced Max The Impaler for the International Princess belt. Shoko used the same phrase to describe her opponent:

Hard mode: here’s the video.

䞭島「座り蟌んで すごいですね。ちょうどゎゞラの新䜜の映画を芋お、怪獣のすごさを思い知ったずいうか。その映画みたいな䞀蚀をマックス・ゞ・むンペむラヌに蚀うなら『ダツは殺しおも死なない』っお蚀葉がすごく䌌合うレスラヌだなず今日実感したしたね」

Nakajima: (sitting down) "
Amazing. I just saw the new Godzilla movie, and I realized how amazing monsters are. If I were to pick a phrase to describe Max The Impaler that sounds like a line from the movie, ‘you couldn’t kill them if you tried’ would fit them to a T. I felt that fully today.”

My Yomichan dictionary actually has a special entry for that specific phrase, haha, because it seems to be common enough to constantly cause translators problems! Here’s a little more about it.

おもいい

As the notes mention, when おもいい is preceded by a verb, it means permission, and なくおもいい means “it is all right if ~ not ~” or “do not have to do ~”.

Other expressions like よろしい(です) (the polite form of いい) and かたいたせん can be used in place of いい(です).

In order from least to most polite:

いい(です) → かたいたせん → よろしい(です)

おもいい also sometimes appears with WH-words like なに and いくら, and in this case, it means “it’s all right no matter what/who/how much/etc. ~” or “it doesn’t matter what/who/how much ~”.

Here's an example from TJPW's 2023.09.18 show, after Yuki Arai and Saki Akai's last time tagging with each other:

No video for this because this was said in the ring!

荒井「涙ぐんでちょっず思っおたより寂しいかもしれない 。なんか䞀生の別れじゃないずは思うんですけど、でもやっぱり赀井さんず䞀緒にいれた時間、リングで喝入れおもらっおる時も、裏ずかで䞀緒にボヌっずしおる時間ずかもすごい奜きだったので、寂しいなずいたすごく感じたした。ホントに自分のプロレスラヌ人生の䞭で、赀井さんず組めた時間があっお本圓に幞せです。ありがずうございたす。堎内拍手 赀井さん、私はタッグを組んでる期間、ホントに私もわがたたずいうか、私のしたいこずを奜きにさせおもらっお感謝しおいたす。最埌にもうひず぀だけ、わがたたを蚀っおもいいですか 私ず最初で最埌のシングルマッチ、よろしくお願いしたす」

Arai: (in tears) “I might miss her a bit more than I expected
 I don’t think of this as a farewell forever, but I really liked the time I spent with Akai-san, whether she was encouraging me in the ring, or whether we were hanging out together in the back and such, so I really feel like I’m going to miss her. I’m truly blessed to have had this time in my wrestling career where I was able to team up with Akai-san. Thank you so much.” (audience applauds) “
Akai-san, when we were a tag team, I was really selfish, or I should say that I’m really grateful to you for letting me do what I wanted to do. Can I say one more selfish thing here at the very end? Please give me a first and last singles match with you.”

赀井「私、優垌ちゃんのそういう怖いもの知らずなずころ、奜きやで。ちょっずいた急に蚀われたので、ただ自分自身、ファむタヌずしお優垌ちゃんの顔を蹎る芚悟ができおないですけど。い぀詊合かは分かんないですけど、自分が東京女子に䞊がる時にシングルやっお。優垌ちゃんの顔をいっぱい フェむスパックしお、぀る぀るに磚いおおいおください」

Akai: “I like that fearless part of you, Yuki-chan. This is the first I’ve heard of this request, so I’m not prepared to kick Yuki-chan in the face as a fighter just yet. I don’t know when the match will be, but when I step into TJPW, let’s do a singles match. Please be sure to wear a lot of facial masks and polish your face until it shines.”

Next up is the ずs! I think I’ll save those for their own post, haha.

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I was hoping to get a little further by the end of the year, but I got totally swamped these past couple weeks, so I couldn’t get any more reading done :smiling_face_with_tear:. Still planning on getting as caught up as possible before the next club, though!

ず1

Pretty straightforward! As note 1 tells us, this is used to list things exhaustively. The final ず is usually omitted, but the others are not. It connects noun phrases only, so it can’t be used for “and” in sentences. N1 ず N2 (ず N3
) is a noun phrase, so it can occur anywhere nouns can occur.

Note 4 has one of my translation enemies: when N1 ず N2 is used as the subject of a sentence, the sentence can be ambiguous, though if the predicate contains reciprocal words, that can clear it up.

Related expressions note I says that when two people are doing an action (like playing tennis) together, it can be restated with ず2 “with” (though the speaker will be speaking from the viewpoint of the individual marked by は).

や is also used to list things, but unlike ず, the listing is inexhaustive.

And note III says that the particle に can be used to combine two or more objects that usually come as a set, which is I think new information for me! The difference between ず and に is that に always implies that one or more objects has been added to the first object as an indispensable member of the entire set (ず doesn’t necessarily carry that implication).

No examples for the ずs because they’d be too much of a pain to search for, haha.

ず2

Totally forgot what “NP” was and had to look it up because I couldn’t find it easily in the book
 it’s “noun phrase” :weary:

Note 1 tells us that when Y is the subject of a clause, X ず indicates that X and Y have a reciprocal relationship. In reciprocal sentences, the subject and X in X ず are interchangeable.

Here, too, some reciprocal expressions take X に or X ず, depending on meaning. In this case, the difference is that ず implies a “bidirectional” action while に implies a “unidirectional” one.

ず3

Note 1 says that ず is basically used to mark a quotation. The literal meaning of ずいう is “say with (the sound) ~”. This use of ず has been extended to cover indirect quotations and even thoughts. It’s necessary for both direct and indirect quotations. It’s used to mark the content of actions like 思う, 考える, 曞く, 聞く, and 説明する.

Note 3 points out that it’s also used with phonomimes (onomatopoeia?), which is honestly really cool! Makes perfect sense when you think about it! The trick then is remembering which of them take ず and which are typically used with する 

Note 4 seems to be dipping into those pesky onomatopoeia rules, haha. It mentions that when a sound is repeated twice, like バタバタ, ず can be omitted. When a sound is not repeated, though, ず does not drop. I found this article when searching around, which goes into a bit more detail on onomatopoeia and touches on particle use.

Note 5 says that the use of ず with phonomimes is extended to phenomimes and psychomimes. It is at this moment that I realized that I think what’s going on here is these are their words for 擬音語 / 擬声語, 擬態語, and 擬情語? I looked it up, and
 yes!

I definitely read that page at the beginning of the dictionary, but I totally don’t remember their special vocabulary :joy_cat:. Then again, I’ve been reading this dictionary long enough, I’ve actually learned a whole lot more about onomatopoeia since the club began
 I don’t think I knew the different types at the time, whereas now it feels so obvious, haha. I kind of wish they’d just use the Japanese words, honestly
 If we’re going to have to memorize specialized terminology, we might as well just memorize the actual Japanese words :sweat_smile:.

ず4

This one has a rather short entry, all things considered!

Note 1 mentions that in S1 ず S2, S1 must be nonpast even if it expresses a past event or action. Tense is expressed in S2.

Note 2 mentions that in S1 ず S2, S2 cannot be a command, a request, a suggestion, an invitation, or a volitional sentence. This makes sense, as this conjunction marks a condition that brings about an uncontrollable event or a state, and all of those things are controllable.

I think I’ll stop there for now! Less than 100 pages of main entries left, so hopefully I won’t be too behind when the club for the intermediate volume starts, haha. Though I think I might be at my 3 posts in a row limit, so I might need someone else to post before I can continue :sweat_smile:


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Well, here is a random post from someone else to break your posting streak. Happy new year, @fallynleaf!

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Now that things are slightly less crazy, I’m gonna try to catch up on at least two weeks of entries every week until I’m caught up with the club, haha.

ず蚀えば

According to the notes, usually a noun phrase is presented by ず蚀えば, but any sentence element is possible (such as the verb phrase in ex. b). Also, the informal form is っお蚀えば.

The related notes compares this with several other expressions used to present topics: ったら is the abbreviation for ずきたら or ずいったら, and it’s used to present noun phrase topics in informal conversation. It’s more emphatic than the topic marker は and sometimes means something like “when it comes to ~” or “in case of ~”.

っお, the abbreviation for ずいうず “when you say ~”, or ずいうのは “what you say (or call) ~”, is also used to present topics in informal conversation. Like ず蚀えば, any sentence element can precede っお, and that element is usually part of the conversation partner’s previous sentence.

I couldn’t find any examples of ず蚀えば or the informal variant in my Tokyo Joshi Pro Wrestling translations!

ずいう

It’s probably obvious, but ずいう is a combination of the quote marker ず and いう “call, say”.

Note 2 points out that the head noun in KS(B) is a noun of communication, and the head noun in KS(C) is a noun of human emotion. I definitely see the latter all the time in my translations! Easy to understand, but hard to put into English in a way that sounds natural :smiling_face_with_tear:.

ずいう is optional if the preceding element is not a noun or a clause which represents a quotation. I could be totally wrong here, but I feel like I usually see it when describing feelings and such even when it’s a verb in front?

When ずいう is used at the end of a sentence, it means hearsay (“I heard that ~, They say ~, It is said that ~”). The sentence-final ずいう is used only in written Japanese.

There are approximately one billion examples of this in my translations, but I went looking for a ずいう気持ち example specifically, and found one in one particularly common form (in this setting). This is from Shino Suzuki's post-match comments after she faced Miu Watanabe in a losing effort in her hometown in the TJPW show on 2023.11.05:

Hard mode: here’s the video (the part quoted below starts around 2:33). I used this post-match comment as an example earlier, but not this part, haha!

志乃「い぀もに増しお勝ちぞの執念を芋せたず思うが静岡凱旋で今日家族も芋おくれたり、私をすごく応揎しおくれおいる方からい぀もに増しお『頑匵れ』ずいうパワヌを感じたので、未詩さんずいう盞手はキャリアもパワヌも、圧倒的に私より遥か䞊をいくけど、こうやっお応揎を力に負けたくないなずいう気持ちがやっぱあった。応揎も倍に感じたので、私の負けたくない気持ちも倍になっお、今日は匷い盞手でしたけど、諊めずに闘いきれたかなず思っおたす」

(I think you showed even more of a determination to win than usual)

Shino: “Since I was returning to my hometown, my family were there to watch me, and I felt that ‘ganbare!’ power from the people cheering for me even more than usual. Miu-san is so far above me both in terms of career and power, but with everyone’s support, I really felt that I didn’t want to lose. I felt double the support, so my desire not to lose was doubled in turn, and even though I was facing a strong opponent, I think I was able to fight without giving up.”

That specific phrasing with 負けたくない comes up a lot in TJPW! Since it’s a kind of universe-important phrase in TJPW, I generally try to keep the wording, even though “feeling that I don’t want to lose” is a slightly weird thing to say in English, haha.

ずか

I didn’t realize this until reading the notes, but ずか is a combination of the quote marker ず3 and か1! This is why it’s often followed by the verb いう. When it’s followed by いう, it’s not a conjunction, it’s a quote marker. The か indicates the speaker’s uncertainty about the quoted report.

N1 ずかいう N2 meaning “N2 that is called N1 or something like that” is another example of ずか used in that sense.

S ずか S ずかする is used when a statement refers to something in general rather than to something specific.

The related expressions note elaborates on this a little. たりたりする, like S ずか S ずかする, indicates an inexhaustive listing of examples, but it differs from S ずか S ずかする because it can be used in both general and specific statements. When たりたりする indicates alternative actions or states, it cannot be replaced by ずか.

There’s a neat 日本語の森 episode on ずか vs たり if you’re looking for a bit more practice!

時

時 by itself means “time”, but when it’s used as a dependent noun with a modifying phrase or clause, it means “at the time when” or “when”. The clause preceding it is a type of relative clause, so the basic rules for relative clauses apply to this construction.

Note 2 tells us that these rules are particularly important: 1) If the subject of the 時 clause is different from that of the main clause, it is marked by が. 2) The predicate form is usually informal except that だ after Adjな stem and N changes to な and の respectively.

The particle に after 時 is optional. With に, time is emphasized and sometimes comes under focus.

If S2 in S1 時 S2 is in the past tense and S1 expresses a state, the tense of S1 can be either past or nonpast. When S1 in S1 時 S2 expresses an action, the meaning of the sentence changes depending on the tenses of S1 and S2.

The related expressions note tells us that unlike when-clauses in English, 時-clauses do not indicate condition. In other words, they’re genuine time clauses. In order to indicate condition as expressed in when-clauses, conjunctions like たら and ず are used. So if the sentence expresses a condition which causes the hearer surprise, 時 can’t be used.

I didn't include a TJPW example for the last entry because I have one that contains both ずか and 時! This is from after Yuka Sakazaki's last, er, well second to last match in TJPW on 2023.12.06, when she faced the other founding members of the company, Shoko Nakajima and Miyu Yamashita, in a 3-way match:

No video because this was said in the ring:

山䞋「10幎間ずっず䞀緒におっお、私にずっおナカちゃんっおホントに お姉ちゃんのようでもあるし、お母さんみたいな 。ホントにいたの自分がレスラヌずしおも人ずしおもあるのは、ナカちゃんのおかげでもあっお。私がダメな時ずか怒っおくれお、でも自分が悲しい時ずか萜ち蟌んでる時ずか、ずっずそばにおっおくれたり、嬉しいから喜んでくれたり。だからホントに私にずっおナカちゃんはすごく倧事な人で、ナカちゃんがそうやっお思っおくれたように私もナカちゃんが苊しい時は私も苊しいし、䜕か怒っおれば 私もたぶんそれ以䞊に怒るし。ナカちゃんがすごく幞せそうに笑っおる時はホントに私もすごく嬉しくお。だからこれから離れおも、力になれるか。アホやしバカやけど、でも私はずっずナカちゃんの味方でいたす。アメリカでもどこでも遠いずころでも、き぀い時は飛んでいきたす。だからナカちゃんらしく、頑匵っおください。あの、無理はしないでください」

Yamashita: “We’ve been together for ten years, and for me, Yuka-chan is really like
 she’s like an older sister to me, and like a mother
 It’s truly thanks to Yuka-chan that I am the wrestler and the person that I am today. You get angry at me when I mess up, but when I’m sad or depressed, you’re always at my side, and your happiness makes me happy. So you’re someone really important to me, and I feel how you feel, so when you’re in pain, I’m in pain, too, and if you’re angry about something
 I’m probably even more angry than you are about it. When you’re laughing happily, I’m truly happy, too. So even though we’re going to be apart, I’m not sure if I can be of any help, and I’m an idiot and a fool, but I’ll always be on your side. Whether you’re in America or anywhere else, no matter how far, I’ll fly over when things get tough. So please do your best in your typical way, Yuka-chan. Well, please don’t overdo it.”

That’s all I have time for today!

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ずころだ1

I was a bit surprised by the definition of this one specifying “a place is in a location which takes a certain amount of time to get to”. That was way more specific that I was assuming? But maybe I’m thinking of a different ずころ 

I don’t think I’m likely to find an example of this in my TJPW translations (and it would be too much of a pain to try searching for one), so I’ll skip finding an example this time.

ずころだ2

This one has caused me some trouble! When I first learned it in my textbook, I became familiar with the uses along the lines of key sentences A-E, but then I started translating TJPW, and plunged into a whole new world
 Instances like the use in example g here are still difficult for me to parse some of the time :sweat_smile:.

As the notes tell us, ずころ itself means “place”, but it can also mean “state” or “time” when it’s used with a modifying verb, adjective, or noun.

Verbs which precede ずころ are either past or nonpast and either progressive or non-progressive, and each of the four verb forms expresses a different aspect of the action. When the preceding verb is nonpast and non-progressive and the following copula is in the past tense, the sentence may mean “someone or something almost did something” (it literally says “someone or something was about to do something”).

ずころ can be followed by the copula, or particles like を, に, ぞ, or で. When adjectives or nouns with の precede ずころ, it’s usually followed by a particle rather than the copula.

The related expressions note says that when ずころ is used as a dependent noun, its function appears to be similar to that of 時, but the difference is that ずころ indicates a state, while 時 indicates a time.

Also, Vお いる/いた ずころだ is similar to Vお いる/いた, but the former focuses more on the state or the scene while the latter concentrates on the action.

Vinf・past ずころだ is similar to Vinf・past ばかりだ, but they have different implications. The former indicates that someone/something is in the state of having just done something, while the latter implies that someone/something did something and not much time has passed since then.

Here's an example from TJPW's 2023.11.05 show, which featured a tag match that was all three wrestlers' last chance to face Yuka Sakazaki before her graduation:

Hard mode: here’s the video (this is a Kamiyu comment, so it’s hard mode even just reading it
).

䞊犏「私的にはナカさんがもうすぐ卒業するずいうこずで、私にずっおナカさんず圓たるのが最埌なのかなず思っお。なんかさみしいし、ナカさんに頑匵っお匷いずころを芋せたいなずいう気持ちにもなったし。私、ナカさんずは唯䞀、先茩の䞭でデビュヌしおからシングルを䞀床もしたこずがない。普段から私のおこないがいいので、免れたなずいう達成感に満ち溢れおいお。で、WiFi 䞍気味なアむドルもどきがいるじゃないですか。あの子はい぀も䞍気味で角田奈穂ずタッグチャンピオンになっおからさらに䞍気味になったなず思ったんですけど、ちゃんず今日は初手で角田奈穂をハブにしおお、やっぱり人間味があるなず。普通に考えたら長いものに巻かれたいずいうのが人間の性さがなので、あの子にも人間らしいずころがあっおよかったなず思ったのず、角田奈穂はマゞで普通で。東京にいようがどこにいようが普通だなず思ったので、たあハブかれお圓然だなず思いたした。友達にはなれたせん」

Kamifuku: “Yuka-san is graduating soon, so I think this will be my last time facing her. I felt a bit sad, and I wanted to show Yuka-san how hard I work and how strong I am. Out of all of my senpais, Yuka-san is the only one I’ve never had a singles match with since my debut. I was filled with an overwhelming sense of accomplishment that, since I always conduct myself so well, I managed to evade her. And, WiFi? That weird sham idol? I thought that girl was always weird, and she got even weirder after she became tag champs with Nao Kakuta, but today at the beginning she left out Nao Kakuta, and I was like ‘wow she’s human after all.’ It’s just human nature to want to join up with someone stronger than you, so I was glad to see that that girl has some human-ish qualities, and Nao Kakuta is seriously so normal. I think she’d be normal whether we’re in Tokyo or not, so I think it’s natural to leave her out. We can’t be friends.”

ずしお

A short entry! But a straightforward one, I think. The dictionary has no notes for this, and I don’t think I do either :joy_cat:.

I see this a lot in TJPW! I'll start off with an example from my first (I guess technically second...) translation of the year, which was the press conference on 2023.01.03 before their むッテンペン show the next day:

No timestamp for this one because the video is long, but here’s the official transcript. I think Ryo Mizunami explains the context well enough:

氎波「今幎は蟰幎。私、蟰幎生たれなので幎女なんですよ。そんな䞭で今回カヌド倉曎になったずは蚀え、この東京女子プロレスのタッグのベルトを巻くチャンス。これは私が蟰幎の幎女ずいうのもあるのかなず思いながら、今この堎にいるんですけど、自分ず愛野のタッグはでじもんや癜昌倢ず組んでいる回数を比べれば、ただただ数回しか経っおないけど、そこは熱さず情熱でカバヌしお今回この東京女子プロレスのタッグのベルトを巻いお、私ず愛野のタッグチヌムがチャンピオンずしお東京女子プロレスに名を刻みたいず思っおおりたす。今幎も熱く爆発しおいきたす 以䞊です」

Mizunami: “This year is the Year of the Dragon. I was born in the Year of the Dragon, so it’s my year. In the midst of this, the card was changed, but it became a chance for me to win the TJPW tag belts. Though here I am thinking that maybe this happened because it’s the Year of the Dragon, my year, but if you compare the number of times Yuki and I have teamed up to that of Daisy Monkey and Daydream, it’s still only been a few times, but we’re going to compensate for that with passion and enthusiasm and win the TJPW tag belts, and our tag team will etch our names in the history of TJPW as champions. We’re going to burst out with passion this year, too! That’s all!”

ずしおは

I’m not sure I’m super familiar with this specific use, though I suppose it conceptually makes sense to me from the perspective of ずしお + contrastive は.

The related expressions tells us that にしおは is also used to present a standard for comparisons, though it differs in terms of the speaker’s presupposition. Sentences with X にしおは presuppose that the person or the thing referred to by the subject is X, whereas those with X ずしおは have no such presupposition. I guess I’m not sure I fully understand this? I can’t make sense of example (a) if Mr. Johnson is not a first-year Japanese student


The two expressions are also different in that にしおは can be used when the speaker doesn’t know exactly what they are comparing with the standard they present, but ずしおは can’t be used in such situations.

I actually had trouble finding an example of this! I gave up after checking about a dozen or so examples, but all the ずしおは examples I found appear to be the role meaning ずしお + は without the “indicating a standard for comparisons” meaning that this entry is focusing on.

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぀もり

぀もり is a dependent noun and must be preceded by a modifier. The minimal modifier is その, “that.”

The subject of a statement containing ぀もりだ must be the first person or someone with whom the speaker empathizes, though in a question, it must be the second person or someone with whom the speaker empathizes.

぀もりだ can be negated in two ways. The verb/adjective in front of it can be negated, or it itself can be negated as ぀もりはない. The second implies a stronger negative than the first.

The related expressions note warns us that ぀もり should not be confused with はず, which means “expectation” rather than “conviction”.

぀もりだ is also comparable but not identical to ようず思う, which can replace ぀もりだ only when a verb precedes ぀もりだ. Also, ようず思う indicates a spur-of-the-moment decision while ぀もりだ indicates a more stable conviction/intention.

Here are a few examples from a funny moment from the TJPW show on 2023.09.10. Miu Watanabe and Rika Tatsumi (who already had a belt, which was the International Princess Championship) lost their chance to get a tag title shot at the next big show. The backstage comments had a classic Rika moment...

Hard mode: here’s the video.

蟰巳「ダメでしたね 負けちゃいたしたね。こんなはずじゃなかったんですけど」

Tatsumi: “It’s no good
 we lost. It wasn’t supposed to go like this.”

未詩「そうですね 。タッグのベルトを取ったら、私はやりたいこずがあったから。絶察ここで取っお、チャンスが蚪れたからには絶察にここで逃しおはいけないっお時だったからこそ、ちょっず悔しいですね」

Miu: “Yeah
 If we’d won the tag belts, I had something I wanted to do. We absolutely had to win them here. Since we had the chance, we couldn’t let them slip away from us here, so that’s really frustrating.”

蟰巳「そうですね。ピンクのベルトは久しく巻いおないですし、恋しいんですよ、ピンクのベルトちゃんが」

Tatsumi: “Yeah. I haven’t had the pink belt around my waist in a long time, and I miss it, Pink Belt-chan.”

未詩「たぶんベルトも恋しがっおるずも思っおお」

Miu: “I think it (the belt) probably misses you, too.”

蟰巳「なんですけど。それに私はここを取っお、10・9、このベルトの防衛戊もやるし、ピンクのベルトを懞けた決定戊も2戊やる぀もりだったので」

Tatsumi: “I know it does. Besides, I was going to win the belts, and then on October 9, I was going to defend this belt, and also do a deciding match with the pink belts on the line.”

未詩「2戊やる぀もりだった」

Miu: “You were going to do two matches?”

蟰巳「やる぀もりでしたよ。䞡方やった方がいいでしょ」

Tatsumi: “Yes, I was. It’s better to do both.”

未詩「はい。 え もちろん、その぀もり でしたよね」

Miu: “Yes. 
What? Of course, naturally that’s what you’d do. I’m on the same page.”

蟰巳「で、未詩に負担をかけようっお思っおたの」

Tatsumi: “I was thinking of putting the burden on Miu.”

未詩「なんで え、分かんない、分かんない。私はこっちIP王座はお䌑みでタッグっお思っおたんですけど」

Miu: “What? Huh?! I’m lost again. I thought you’d give the International Championship a break and focus on the Tag.”

蟰巳「そんなわけないじゃん」

Tatsumi: “Out of the question.”

未詩「すみたせん。そんなわけないです。誰ですか、そんなこず蚀ったの」

Miu: “Pardon me, of course it’s out of the question. Who could have suggested such a thing?”

蟰巳「倢のたた倢になっちゃいたした」

Tatsumi: “Now it’s just an unrealistic dream.”

未詩「リカさんがずっずこれを防衛しおたら、たた2冠懞けた詊合みたいな倧䌚も起こるかもしれないし」

Miu: “If Rika-san is constantly defending this, there might be another show with two belts on the line.”

蟰巳「い぀でもその準備しずいお」

Tatsumi: “Be ready for it at all times.”

っお1

This was one of those things I wished beginner textbooks introduced way, way earlier, haha, because it was very confusing to me at first!

The notes say that you shouldn’t use Adj(な) stem っお, unless it is an adjective that can also be used as a noun. It also says you shouldn’t confuse っお1 with っお2 of hearsay. I definitely sometimes struggle with this


Note 3 tells us that っお tends to co-occur with the sentence final particles ね and よ. Considering how common all of those things are, I’m not sure this really helps, haha.

The related expressions note says when っお is attached to a noun, it’s close in meaning to the topic marker は, and when it’s attached to a sentence, it’s close in meaning to ず(いう)のは. But っお, however, is more colloquial and emotive than either of the others, and in fact, if the predicate does not express the speaker’s emotive judgment/evaluation, っお can’t be used.

っお2

Quote+っお2 is a colloquial version of Quote+ず3, and any quotation which can precede ず3 can precede っお. When there is a human topic in the っお construction, the sentence is ambiguous as to whose quotation it is. The person who is quoting can be either the topic person or “they”. But if a reporting verb 蚀う is used after っお, then the sentence means “The person (topic) says that ~”. When っお is not followed by a verb, the understood verb is 蚀う. Other verbs (such as 思う) can’t be deleted after っお.

Interestingly, according to the related expressions note, 蚀った, 蚀っおいる, and 蚀っおいた (and their polite equivalents) can be deleted after っお2, but not after ず3. The difference between them is that the former is more emphatic and emotive owing to its glottal stop.

When the subject of the understood 蚀う is an unspecified person(s), っお2 is similar to the hearsay そうだ1 “they say”, but っお is more colloquial and informal. Xがいっおいたけど, “X was saying but” or its variants are used when specifying an informational source in the っお construction, not the usual Xによるず.

I don’t think I’m going to look for any っお examples because I feel like it would be too much of a headache trying to sort through all of the おform instances and such.

And with that, I’m done with the T’s finally!

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