コンビニ人間: Week 1 Discussion

Japanese Language Reading
#1

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コンビニ人間 Home Thread

Week 1

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Start Date: June 29th
Next Chapter: Week 2

Reading:

Start Page End Page (PB) End Page (HB) End % End Phrase Pages
Beginning 18 13 9% どんどん大人になっていった。 11

Word lists - Learn the vocabulary for コンビニ人間

Discussion Rules

  • Please use spoiler tags for major events in the current chapter(s) and any content in future chapters.
  • When asking for help, please mention the chapter and page number. Also mention what version of the book you are reading.
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Week 1 session (in your timezone): Sunday, July 7, 2019 12:30 PM TZ

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コンビニ人間: Week 2 Discussion
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コンビニ人間 Home Thread (Intermediate Book Club)
#2

Okay I’m gonna post the first question for this week:

In the beginning where she’s serving the customer and he looks over to the hot dogs there’s this part:
画面をタッチしながら、男性の目線がファーストフードが並んだショーケースにすっと移ったのを見て、指の動きを止める。

So, I guess the customer is the one touching the screen, and therefore he is probably also doing the 指の動きを止める at the end. But the middle part is about an action that she’s doing, right? Since it says she sees how his eyes go over to the showcase.
But it feels extremely unnatural to have this switch of subjects in the middle of the sentence here; the only way it would seem grammatically consistent to me is if she were also doing the touching and stopping the finger movement.

Can someone explain what is going on here? Is it really possible to simply switch subjects with seemingly no other indication except context here? Or am I missing some clues?

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#3

I break that in two parts:

画面をタッチしながら、〜を見て、指の動きを止める。

While touching the screen, she sees ~ and her finger stops moving.

男性の目線がファーストフードが並んだショーケースにすっと移った

What she saw.

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#4

That is the only logical meaning I could come up with, too, but it didn’t make sense in context (on first thought).
So she is the one touching the screen? I was wondering how this konbini age check works exactly, but I didn’t think about the possibility that both of them would have to touch the screen.

#5

For the Konbini age check; most stores have a touch screen facing the customer that displays what’s being scanned. If anything is age restricted, towards the end of the transactions the screen comes up with an age verification question and you have to tap the screen to confirm you are over 20.

I’ll see if I can find a picture

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#6

This is a very typical layout

image https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn%3AANd9GcStpS_6w_Ex74m9hsh1WnIVLf25lj9FnEZvA480sBfdqTv04-Ex

Note the screen facing the customer side of the counter. That’s what you touch for age verification.

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#7

And here’s one showing the age check:

image https://tech.nikkeibp.co.jp/it/atcl/watcher/14/334361/121700978/?SS=imgview_sp&FD=-1422788992

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#8

Oh, I thought it was: while touching the screen, he keeps looking at the showcases fast food - which is what she is watching (and her fingers stop moving because she is focused on watching him).

And I didn‘t think anything was weird with it but that might very well be that the reason for that is that I have no idea what I‘m doing. (Because I also had the mental image of how only he is touching the screen which is the regular scenario?)

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#9

Wooh, here we go!

I only had one question for this week.

Page 13 question

「なんで？せっかく死んでるのに」

せっかく is one of those words I just don’t get. I have no idea what it means here.

General comments

So I commented vaguely in the home thread already, but I really liked the first week’s reading. I thought the flashbacks did a great job of establishing the main character and how her mind works. Even though she eventually learned how to not get into trouble, it’s not because she actually understands why acting a certain way is right.

I also liked that the author immediately threw out the “victim” situation. She was loved by her family and while she didn’t make any friends, she also wasn’t particularly bullied. That kind of story can get tedious, so I’m glad we get to avoid it entirely.

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#10

That’s probably because it has three specific, completely unrelated possible meanings when translated in English :stuck_out_tongue:
I haven’t read this week’s part yet, but I guess it’s the “something finally happened” meaning.

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#11

And yet I can’t find anything resembling that definition in jisho or two Japanese only dictionaries I checked (unless I just don’t understand the definitions either). Care to point me to any reference for that when you get a chance?

#12

I just checked Jisho and I meant definition 2. “Long-awaited”

Here’s a Japanese resource that covers every nuance. You can just skip to the せっかく〜なのに part though.

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#13

The examples from that article (and jisho) indicate that the “long awaited” definition is a の-adjective. Doesn’t it have to be an adverb in this case since it proceeds 死んでる?

#14

There’s a slight difference in meaning when it’s a の adjective/noun or an adverb (see the first part of the Japanese article), but it’s basically the same here. (Last meaning of both categories in this case)

#15

Still can’t say it makes sense. I understand what you’re saying and that definition does make sense in this context, but the article’s not quite making sense to me. The part you linked to is in the 誤用 section, so is it saying that it’s outright wrong or technically wrong but still used?

This hinative answer seems to say the expected form is せっかくの〇〇なのに.

#16

The article linked says the construction is wrong, but really common anyway. I had no idea it was wrong :exploding_head:

I’ll have a closer look when I actually get there in the book.

EDIT: to future-proof the conversation, せっかくなのに is technically wrong, but very used. However, せっかく(something, or のsomething)(な)のに is correct.

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#17

That sounds a bit like what happens with adjectives in general sometimes. すごい楽しい instead of すごくetc.

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#18

But as a grammar nazi, boo!

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#19

I think grammar “rules” don’t really matter, as long as we can still communicate good.

:smirk:

didyouseewhatididthere

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#20

cringe

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