ふらいんぐうぃっち | Week 1 Discussion 🧹

Transliteration problem. Shouldn’t it be “kousai” instead of just “kosai”?

I checked here and its On only has “kou” and “kyou”. No “ko”. :thinking:

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Our cast of characters in week one…

character list

真琴まこと - the protagonist, Makoto

チト - her cat Chito!

けい - her cousin Kei, around the same age

千夏ちなつ - her younger cousin Chinatsu

Thought it might be helpful and also I wanted to try out ruby tags finally :slightly_smiling_face: I’ve just read up to page 10 - tried to fill out the vocab sheet pretty thoroughly as I went.

Pro tip for new readers: you will see the ている form contracted to てる a lot when reading.

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I am curious about the use of 居候 by 千夏 (pg 12) and 圭 (pg 31) to describe 真琴. The definitions/sample sentences that I find for 居候 don’t seem to be particularly flattering (lodger who pays nothing for room and board, freeloader, sponger), given that she is relative come to stay with her family while she goes to school. Am I missing some context to clarify the meaning? Or is 圭 being a bit of jerk?

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I’m reading it on billingualmanga for now while I wait for my physical copy to arrive (hopefuly this coming week). It’s the only site I was able to find to read it in japanese :grimacing:

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@Radish8 Is Chinatsu Kei’s younger sister?

@Chopped Wah! Your bilingualmanga is colourful! My ebook from bookwalker is only black and white! I thought that was screenshot from its movie/anime version.

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character list correction

千夏ちなつ - Makoto’s daughter, Chinatsu

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Question again, how do I mention/refer a bubble on a page? Let’s say for example page 3 (7/163). Bubble row 2 column 1?

Page 3 (7/163) Bubble row 3 column 2. ズボボ

No entry on jisho. Sounds like オノマトペ? But I don’t know what it refers to :thinking: or its meaning.

Haha yeah, only the first two pages are coloured though.

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I skipped it because we’ll see the same titles across each chapter, but as other’ve mentioned, there’s no reason not to include it in the early discussion =)

Wouldn’t the kanji for this be 弘西? It also comes out to こうさい.

I can’t speak to page 31, but since 居候 is written on page 12 as “いそーろう?”, I take it Chinatsu wasn’t familiar with the term (but I could be wrong). Thus, it’s possible that maybe it’s just Kei referring to Makoto as a freeloader. I can’t comment yet on whether he seems to be saying it seriously or as jest, as we don’t see him use the word between pages 11 and 12.

Edit: I did a Google search for 居候とは and it defines it as:

「他人の家に住んで食わせてもらっている人。」

So, essentially a person who lives in someone else’s house and is provided for. I don’t know if it carries the same negative connotation as “freeloader” in English. The closest non-negative English word I can find is “dependent”.

It bothers me when e-books are black and white when the original was in color. The same thing is the case for some pages in ごちうさ =(

In most cases, I think it’s not necessary to refer down the bubble if you’ve typed up the word or sentence from it. Anyone looking at the page will be able to find it fairly quickly. But including reference to the panel (such as “page 5, panel 2” or “page 5.2”) can help narrow it down on the overall page.

Just to add to some numbering confusion fun, the table of contents puts the start of this chapter on page 3 (which for my ebook is 5/163), and the page itself includes this number in the bottom-right corner. So 7/163 would be page 5.

I figured it’s the sound effect of putting one’s hands in snow, but considering I’ve only ever been around snow one time in nearly 40 years, I was too busy with my camera at the time to discover the sound effects of snow.

Search for “ずぼ” on these pages:

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My understanding is that 千夏 got that word from 圭, as you suggest, and is unfamiliar with it. The word is in kana and she is elongating it with a question mark. When 圭 brings it up again, it is the kanji. He says 「へー、親戚が居候」which seems like he knows there is a difference.This leads me to believe he is kinda being a jerk about her staying. Though, reading ahead, this seems to be a bit in character for him.

On second thought, I should be reading that が as a subject marker and not an “or”. Then it becomes he has a relative that is staying for free. I guess I just find it odd that that distinction is being made, particularly of someone in their teens.

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Well they are second cousins, which maybe makes it a bit more unusual.

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Ah, yes, the world-famous “conversation exploded while I was sleeping”.

I just checked the jisho link, and it doesn’t make clear that 一人前 means you have finished your training. Until then, you are, usually, 見習い (apprentice). ARIA has a grade in between (半人前) but I don’t know if it’s a real thing.

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When this happens for me (uncertainty on use of a word), I do a search of subtitles I’ve downloaded for anime I own on DVD.

In Sailormoon (classic), episode 25, Mako-chan sees the cat, Luna. Usagi says 「ウチに居候してるネコちゃんよ」 (that’s the cat staying at my house). If there was a negative connotation to this (like “freeloader” in English), Luna (having human-like intelligence) should react to it, but doesn’t.

In Detective Conan, episode 2, after Shinichi has become a child and calls himself Conan, Professor Agasa suggests Conan stay with Shinichi’s friend Ran. Conan says, 「蘭とこに居候してて正体がバレたらどうするんだよ」, expressing concern that Ran will find out his identity if he stays over at her place.

I vote: ignore the English word “freeloader” in Japanese-to-English dictionaries =D

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It’s in the dictionary at least, with a reasonably relevant definition.

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Yes, but modern usage (as I could see on a google search) only seem to use that word to describe someone incompetent, while 見習い is used regularly for people in training, and 一人前 for accomplished professionals.
So I was wondering if the progression seen in ARIA is (was?) an actual thing or not.
I haven’t had the time yet, but when I get the chance, I’ll have a look at what happens for blacksmiths, since I have the image they are going through apprenticeship as well.

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Regarding 一人前:

This word is used in Sailormoon Crystal, episode 7, when Luna is explaining to Sailor V that Sailormoon is still “inexperienced” as a guardian: 「特にセーラームーンは戦士としてはまだ半人前で」

For another example, in Clannad After Story, episode 15, the male lead character’s co-workers are congratulating him on soon being a father. One says, 「まだまだ社会人としては半人前だがしては これで一人前にならざるを得ないな」, saying he may “not yet be a full-fledged” member of society, but he’ll be forced to grow quickly now.

Granted, one can’t necessarily count on manga and anime to give an idea of modern usage, but there it is.

For the on-topic manga, I took Kei’s line to essentially mean “until she’s able to live on her own”.

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Your second example is exactly what I meant. The character means he isn’t yet fully accomplished, he doesn’t have an actual rank/status of 半人前. I do not now the context of sailor moon, but I assume it’s the same.
In the manga ARIA people have 半人前 as their actual job title.

I disagree with that interpretation. I took it as her getting her certification as witch.

(Sorry, no time and on the phone, so I’m a bit terse)

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Knowing nothing about the series, I interpreted it the same way as you. Of course, since I’ve read 魔女の宅急便 it just seems “normal” to me for a witch to have to leave home for training.

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My try in translating the first chapter title page (6/163).

第一話・6年振りの不思議

Chapter 1 Story . Six years shaking of Marvel? :sweat_smile: cmiiw

Could be; we’re looking at two different meanings for the same word. I’m sure once I read more of the story, it’ll be more clear to me. At this point in reading, I don’t recall any mention of her being a witch.

It seems 年振り is an expression for “after an interval of … years; for the first time in … years”.

It’d say “Marvel after 6 Years” or perhaps a little more proper-sounding in English, “First Marvel in 6 Years”.

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