Deepl and google translate are weak on numbers

[2000kanji]

I just encountered the following sentence containing percentages:
ある野球チームは、次の試合に勝つと勝率が6割2分5厘になり、負けると勝率が5割になるそうです。

deepl translates this sentence as:
A baseball team has a .602 winning percentage when it wins its next game and a .500 winning percentage when it loses.
Without context it translates 6割2分5厘 as:
60.2 percent and a half, with the equally false alternative ‘60.2% to 60.5%’.

google translates the complete sentence as:
A certain baseball team is said to have a winning percentage of 60%, 2 minutes and 5% when it wins the next game, and a 50% winning percentage when it loses.
Without context it translates 6割2分5厘 as:
60% 2 minutes 5 rins

The correct translation of 6割2分5厘 is 62.5% as 割 is 10%, 分 is a tenth of a 割 and 厘 is a hundredth of a 割.

[pm215]

@2000kanji

6割2分5厘

Neat – I didn’t know this system had units smaller than the 割 == 10% one (which I see a lot).

[Gorbit99]

These systems are rarely used, and there’s two of them, with the second system being the exact same, 'cept it’s shifted up once, so 分 is 10%. With these I sort of understand, that both translators would be confused as hell.

[Gorbit99]

埃 is 10^-10, it’s as useful as it sounds

[Kazzeon]

Is it weak with numbers or with Japanese words for numbers that I had never seen before in my life.

Though tbf I do not read stuff with percentages that often.

[Gorbit99]

There are two places these are still used in. Batting averages (because of course) and discounts. Unless you watch baseball, read baseball manga or go shopping in Japanese stores, you won’t see them much

[2000kanji]

BTW the text goes on with
現在このチームは何勝何敗でしょう?
And the answer is ４勝３敗

[Vanilla]

@Gorbit99

These systems are rarely used,

I feel like you really gotta separate 割 if you are gonna say that because that ones pretty common

[Gorbit99]

@Vanilla

I feel like you really gotta separate 割 if you are gonna say that because that ones pretty common

I meant rare more in the sense that “it’s used in a few scenarios only”, but you are right.

Interestingly, chatgpt gets it right:

Seems like our AI overlords aren’t completely hopeless

[2000kanji]

As I learned in the jisho articles, they are also used for subdivisions of a yen (if you should ever need those).

[2000kanji]

@Kazzeon

Is it weak with numbers or with Japanese words for numbers

It’s also weak with plain numbers - see Deepl and the discovery of America

[Vanilla]

@Gorbit99

I meant rare more in the sense that “it’s used in a few scenarios only”, but you are right.

Yeah, I was also disagreeing with that. Specifically this comment

@Gorbit99

There are two places these are still used in. Batting averages (because of course) and discounts. Unless you watch baseball, read baseball manga or go shopping in Japanese stores, you won’t see them much

I’ve seen it basically only in contexts that aren’t those and its used for just about anything you can use a percentage of a whole for it seems. Searching 60 books specifically for “８割” (not any of the other numbers) I get 10 hits. if you include the other numbers 1-9 the number goes even higher.

For cuteness

女の子のかわいさは髪型と表情と仕草と雰囲気とメイクが８割ぐらいだし！

progress on writing

「ってことは、もう８割くらいは書けてるんだよね？」

air in a bottle

そして、４本目の日本酒を８割ほど空けたところでついに酔いつぶれ、「ふにゃぁん……」とちゃぶ台に突っ伏して寝てしまった。

emotion related shiet

和泉が送るデータを間違えたんじゃないかというのは、８割がた本気の推測だった。

嬉しさが２割、驚きと戸惑いが８割といった京だったが、それ以上に大きく反応したのは伊月と春斗の作家２名だった。

「はは、あの人の言葉は８割方照れ隠しだと思っておけばいいよ」

no comment

表にはメイド服を着て微笑む姿が描かれ、裏側では乳首こそ描かれていないものの８割ほどメイド服をひん剥かれたあられもない姿で恥じらいながらもどこか嬉しそうな顔をしている。

consumed food

料理を８割がた食べ終えたところで、春斗が提案した。

group of people

「それ言われると多分日本の大学生の８割くらいがダメージ受けるからやめてあげて」と春斗が苦笑いを浮かべた。

[Kazzeon]

I also meant besides 割.

[sirati97]

i have never seen it but the same character (not simplified the same way) exists in chinese for that purpose. chinese also has a milli character

[Rrwrex]

I’ve not seen this used with 割 before, but I think 分 (pronounced ぶ) and 厘 (りん or り)
mean “tenths” and “hundredths” of whatever comes before.

They are definitely part of the 尺貫法 measurement system (the marks on a traditional Japanese carpenter’s square).

In this case, I don’t think 割/分/厘 is a whole new system so much, it’s thinking of 6割2分5厘 as “six parts, and 2.5 tenths of a part”.

[Brand_S]

I was just banging my head in frustration about not just translations of counters but auto-generated readings of counters. I’m reading about combinatorics and radix conversions so I see the 通り and 進 counters a lot. The readings and rendaku have been all over the place. Even OJAD read 二進 as にっち when the correct reading in context was にしん.

EDIT:

@Rrwrex

I’ve not seen this used with 割 before, but I think 分 (pronounced ぶ) and 厘 (りん or り)
mean “tenths” and “hundredths” of whatever comes before.

I just like these readings because they give me an excuse to dazzle native speakers who wouldn’t expect me to know them! It’s the same reason I’m always lowkey disappointed when I learn a new word for a concept only to find out native speakers just use an English loanword instead.

[Rrwrex]

@Brand_S

only to find out native speakers just use an English loanword instead.

35 years of marriage. At least 4 years of which consists of me asking how to say something in Japanese and hearing katakana-go in response.

Mind you, remembering exactly which English word gets mangled is the tricky bit.

[Gorbit99]

@Rrwrex

Mind you, remembering exactly which English word gets mangled is the tricky bit.

If it’s an english word at all. Wasei-eigo is probably the most fun Japanese gets.

Microwave oven - 電子レンジ, from apparently “electic range”
Axolotl - ウーパールーパ, comes from the supposed word “wooper looper”

[Rrwrex]

@Gorbit99

Axolotl - ウーパールーパ, comes from the supposed word “wooper looper”

Not this?

[Kazzeon]

Smh.