レンタルおにいちゃん Volume 3

[ChristopherFritz]

Volume 3 Discussion Thread

Start Date: 2021-02-11T15:00:00Z

レンタルおにいちゃん Reading Club Home Thread

Character Lists

Characters are listed under chapter of first appearance within the volume. Unlisted chapters/weeks do not introduce new characters.

Chapter 11 (week 1)

立花(たちばな) 叶実(かなみ)

旭(あさひ) 慎(まこと)

立花(たちばな) 一敬(かずたか)

Chapter 11 (week 2)

町谷(まちや) 大吾(だいご)

大吾(だいご)の母(はは)

Chapter 13 (week 6)

みすず

みすずのお母(かあ)さん

しおり

Vocabulary Lists

レンタルおにいちゃん Vocabulary

Reading Schedule

I set out to do two weeks per chapter, but chapter 11 is the heaviest chapter in the book and includes Kansai dialect. Since there were votes for both one and two week breaks in-between volumes (with more votes to one week), I figured splitting the first chapter into three would be a good compromise.

Week	Start Date	Pages*	Chapter
Week 1	Feb 12th	003–017 (12 pages)	Chapter 11 part 1
Week 2	Feb 19th	018–028 (10 pages)	Chapter 11 part 2
Week 3	Feb 26th	029–040 (12 pages)	Chapter 11 part 3
Week 4	Mar 5th	041–054 (13 pages)	Chapter 12 part 1
Week 5	Mar 12th	055–072 (13 pages)	Chapter 12 part 2
Week 6	Mar 19th	075–089 (14 pages)	Chapter 13 part 1
Week 7	Mar 26th	090–106 (15 pages)	Chapter 13 part 2
Week 8	Apr 2nd	107–124 (15 pages)	Chapter 14 part 1
Week 9	Apr 9th	125–144 (13 pages)	Chapter 14 part 2
Week 10	Apr 16th	147–170 (14 pages)	Chapter 15 part 1
Week 11	Apr 23rd	171–190 (14 pages)	Chapter 15 part 2

* Pages with no dialogue (or only a few words) are excluded from page counts. For anyone reading a set number of pages each day, this may help with pacing. Essentially, if you make it through two dialogue-filled pages per day, you’re mostly to keep on track.

Discussion Rules

• If you have any questions, don’t hesitate to ask.
• Please mention the chapter and page number.
• Please use spoiler tags for major events.
• If you read ahead, please hold questions questions until during or after the appropriate week.

[stevo2011]

I was just about to start reading this today…

[ChristopherFritz]

Week 1: Pages 3–17

Start Date: 2021-02-11T15:00:00Z

Chapter 11 continues from where volume 2 left off.

Participation

Mark your participation status by voting in this poll.
(You can change your answer later if you’d like.)

• I’m reading along.
• I have finished this part.

Due to the past two weeks being unplanned-busy for me, I don’t have the vocabulary sheet ready yet, but I’ll try to have it together soon. Vocabulary sheet will be linked to only in the first post.

[2OC3aOdKgwSGlxfz]

Interesting start for レンタル おにいちゃん Vol 3 いもうと Vol 1

[BarelyFragile]

Let’s be honest, don’t we all wish we could rent-a-Kanami for snacks and shopping?

[ChristopherFritz]

@BarelyFragile

rent-a-Kanami

Don't be me. Speak clearly when placing a rental request.

[BarelyFragile]

Not sure you can take this one out for プリン but at least it’s got the nostalgia factor. Better luck next time!

[ChristopherFritz]

On rental attempt two, I specifically requested the プリン package.

[BarelyFragile]

Amazing プリン package! Bet you slept like a baby (and potentially woke up with strange markings on your face and the rental no where to be seen?)! Your mistake, I think, is that you have to ask for rent-a-Kanami along with the add-on.

[kousei22]

Hi everyone!! So glad to be back with volume 3 of レンタルいもうと ( ) ! I didn´t even turn the page to see what was coming, such a cliffhanger it was in some sense that strange noise . Just a question for now!

p. 9

オムライスがおいしいって評判なんだよ

My problem is getting the exact nuance of that 評判 with regards to the preceding grammar of the おいしいって. I´ve seen that in Jisho it can also mean, aside from “reputation” or “fame”, “rumor” or even “talk”. In the latter usage, there are examples with the quotation particle, and in that sense the grammar would fit better, but not the meaning, since I assume the use of 評判 here denotes specifically that that shop is famous for its オムライス. So my problem is kind of fitting all the parts together (vocabulary and grammar) satisfactorily.

Many thanks in advance, as always!

[ChristopherFritz]

As you’ve seen, 評判 has a few related meanings. It can be used for criticisms, rumors, and fame. I get the impression that it’s a reflection of people talking about something, as opposed to being famous for another reason. (But I could be wrong. Just the kind of usage I’ve seen reading manga and watching anime.)

I’ve followed the view espoused by Cure Dolly, of seeing a sentences essentially as nouns, adjectives, or verbs that are modified by other words. In that sense, we have:

「おいしいって」 modifies 「評判」

The オムライス is 評判, but what about it is making it 評判? It can be 評判 for all kinds of reasons. So we’re modifying it to specify the reason. It’s people saying 「おいしい」 about it that makes the オムライス be 評判.

[kousei22]

So I see! Many thanks for the clarifying! I was just now wondering, a bit theoretically:

@ChristopherFritz

The オムライス is 評判, but what about it is making it 評判?

Would it be also grammatically possible for 評判 to be modifying ここのお店?

[ChristopherFritz]

Rather than ここの, I believe you’d use この.

I can’t speak from experience, but here are some items I see online:

Japanese	English
ネットで評判のこのお店	This store has a (good) reputation on the Internet.
以前から「おいしい」と評判のこのお店！	This restaurant has a long-standing reputation for being delicious!
カレーうどんが美味しいと評判のこのお店	This restaurant has a reputation for delicious curry udon.

Here, it’s using 評判 to limit, out of all possible お店 that can be talked about, the お店 with this 評判 is the お店 being talked about. Note that we’re talking about the store.

Of course, they can modify in the opposite order for a different meaning:

Japanese	English
このお店の評判がいいよ	The reputation of this store is good!
就任前、このお店の評判は、かんばしいものではなかった。	Before I joined, this reputation of this store was not good.
お昼の店を探して行ったが、このお店の評判が良かった。	I went looking for a restaurant to have lunch, and the reputation of this restaurant was good.

Here, it’s using お店 to limit, of all the 評判 that can be talked about, the 評判 that this お店 has is the one specifically being talked about. Note we’re talking about the reputation.

[kousei22]

That really really helped! Many thanks for the search!! I sometimes feel truly fascinated about how は and が work when kind of expressing what in English we would address with the verb “have”. For instance, ここのお店 here seems to be the topic, but (as you said) オムライスがおいしいって applies in fact to 評判. I think the obvious English translation disturbed my deep comprehension. When will my mind start to think in Japanese??

[ChristopherFritz]

@ChristopherFritz

Rather than ここの, I believe you’d use この.

Ah, I see now that this is what’s used in the manga. (Far be it from me to provide a correction on something like this!)

I’ve actually never knowingly seen this use of ここの versus この. I’m going to be on the watch for it from now on! I imagine the two have a similar meaning, but maybe slight variance in nuance. I don’t know if I could express it in English, though. (Maybe sort of like the difference between “this here store” and “this store”, but in English the former sounds a bit hillbilly to me.)

@kousei22

When will my mind start to think in Japanese??

While I can’t speak to thinking in Japanese, the comprehension of Japanese without routing through English will come with 1) learning the grammar, 2) understanding the grammar, and 3) repeated exposure (building pattern recognition).

For me, item 3 is the one that takes the longest. It’d say item 1 is like learning the reading of a Japanese vocabulary word, item 2 is like learning the meaning of the vocabulary word, and 3 is SRSing it until you recognize it without thinking. Sort of like how you probably don’t need to translate words like おにいちゃん or おいしい when you see them.

@kousei22

ここのお店 here seems to be the topic, but (as you said) オムライスがおいしいって applies in fact to 評判.

(Below is just random rambling on my part.)

There’s a few things going on in this sentence, which are worth breaking down. I’ll add in a は to explicitly mark the topic:

「ここのお店は『オムライスがおいしい』って評判だ」

The topic of お店 and the subject of オムライス are essentially parts of two separate sentences, one embedded within the other.

In English, you might say “They say this restaurant has delicious rice.” Here, the rice is described as being delicious, but the overall statement isn’t about the rice, it’s about the restaurant.

If we replace all modifiers with 〇〇, the main sentence looks like:

「〇〇お店は〇〇評判だ」

Looked at this way, we can see that in the main sentence, the topic is explicitly stated (because I put a は in there), but the subject is implied (not spoken).

This is a noun sentence. (It ends in だ, although in the full sentence in the manga, だ became な because a のだ comes after it.) In a noun sentence, you are stating that one noun is in the category of another noun. (Like saying “a kitten is a cat” or “green is a color”.)

In Japanese, the first noun is the subject. The second noun is the category that subject is in.

The second noun is 評判, which is modified as 「オムライスがおいしいって評判」.

The first noun, the subject, is unspoken (due to being clear from context).

The context tells us that it’s the restaurant that is in the category of places with such a 評判.

In English you wouldn’t say, “Speaking of this restaurant, this restaurant has a reputation for delicious rice”; rather, the second instance of “this restaurant” would be replaced with “it”, as in: “Speaking of this restaurant, it has a reputation for delicious rice.” In Japanese, rather than using a word such as “it”, the noun gets dropped completely (unspoken).

And since Japanese is a topic-prominent language (whereas English is a subject prominent language), when the topic and the subject are the same, you usually get the topic spoken and the subject not spoken.

(For those who made it this far, thanks for reading my random rambling.)

[kousei22]

@ChristopherFritz

(For those who made it this far, thanks for reading my random rambling.)

Bless that “random” rambling!! Your breakdown was so so helpful, as always. Many thanks!

[ChristopherFritz]

Week 2: Pages 18–28

Start Date: 2021-02-18T15:00:00Z

Length-wise, this is the shortest week.

Remember, へん is ない, and や is だ.

Participation

Mark your participation status by voting in this poll.
(You can change your answer later if you’d like.)

• I’m reading along.
• I have finished this part.

[2OC3aOdKgwSGlxfz]

I feel the manga has leveled up with its Kansai-ben into another degree of difficulty…

Page 25

I have no idea what’s going on here… What’s だてに ?
The second dialogue is also very confusing… やって? I guess this could be だって、but then the ないんやから (ないんだから?) feels strange. Is she talking about how Kanami doesn’t have a mother?

Any help is appreciated =@.@=

[ChristopherFritz]

@2OC3aOdKgwSGlxfz

What’s だてに ?

This だて is 伊達, meaning to “show off” or “do something just for show”.

You can say 「だてに～してない」 where ～ is something that looks good, with the meaning “I’m not doing ～ just to show off.”

The ～ here is 「何年も母親」 and it’s using やって rather than して.

I think this is meant to be the verb やる, but it’s confusing! There’s no particle after 母親, so you’d think だ would follow. And we know that some だ become や in Kansai dialect. I mean, she says 「やから」 right here, after all!

So…if we pretend that I’m right about this sentence structure (let’s all have a big imagination here), then I read this as something like, “I haven’t done (being) a mother for many years just for show, after all.” Sort of meaning, “I really am a mother, and this situation calls for a mother.”

Afterwards

Some web search results:

Search	Results
“母親やってない”	93,7000
“母親だってない”	4
“父親やってない”	5,540
“父親だってない”	3

If this や were だ, I would expect the だ version to have more results! So I do think it’s やる.

[2OC3aOdKgwSGlxfz]

Thank you! Hadn’t run into だてに used like that before, very interesting!