Worth subscribing?

What I like the most about an SRS system like WaniKani, Bunpro, Renshuu, Anki, JPDB, etc. is the fact that it relegates vocab and kanji learning to routine. This means that it allows you to kind of forget about the “learning” aspect of vocab, since the system takes advantage of the way your brain remembers things. This then enables you to focus on the other aspects of the language wile not having to worry about keeping up with your vocab.

What sets WaniKani apart from the other SRS systems however is their curated ground up approach. They create a very solid foundation and bridge to our English speaking brain. As you’ve experienced, the radicals build the kanji and the kanji builds the vocab. The mnemonics support this throughout by anchoring these strokes to something our brain understands. It also gives us a fall back option when we totally blank on raw recall for any given item.

Further, by learning the radicals form WK, they give you a toolset to use after you finish WK and mine your own sentences with kanji you’ve never seen before. As well as give you an idea of how you should structure your mnemonics on your own.

WK justifies itself in price for me with their curated collection of radicals and kanji. I don’t have to do all the legwork of figuring out the radicals and kanji, I don’t have to create my own mnemonics, I don’t have to decide what to learn first. All I have to do is do what WK tells me to do. This gives me an amount of freedom (and time) outside of vocab I otherwise wouldn’t have.

I don’t have to do any legwork, I pay WK to do that for me.

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WaniKani may be worth subscribing, for the sake of Kanji. You should still know vocabularies somehow (via WaniKani, or via other SRS, or via somewhere else).

WaniKani, albeit indirectly, via Community / Forum (i.e. here), tells you not to learn too many, not to burn out. And also the WaniKani web app to remember keywords and mnemonics accurately (with 85-95% accuracy, no suspend) via Spaced-Repetition System (SRS).

imo, it’s half true. Kanji may indeed need to be remembered accurately, but that’s also for the sake of keeping vocabularies intact.

Kanji may needed to be learned well and not focusing on too much at a time, but you should still know many vocabularies to useful. (I would even say, secondary SRS, but that’s not the only way. Another is immersion.)

SRS like WaniKani does help gate that, but it’s far from being an optimized SRS, also considering being jumbled with vocabularies, and then also, leech management.

On the other hand, vocabulary knowledge should need to catch up with Kanji levels, to maintain Kanji accuracy. Vocab readings do need to be accurate to keep Kanji readings knowledge accurate. Sokuon, Rendaku, long vowels, too. I’d say, so as to not to lose to natives, while natives do speak with some variations after some point…


imho, if you see something in WK, consider yearly or monthly subs, but not lifetime. You aren’t studying Kanji and vocab for the sake of the system. Also consider adding a secondary SRS for vocabularies.

Also you don’t need to reach level 60 or burn everything; but reaching some high level, and calling it a day, enough. (call it a one or two years?)

You are also allowed to know more Kanji or more readings than your current WK level. Here isn’t everything. WK is more designed for optimal accuracy.

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this is very true!!! (for kitsun and marumori)

I had a free trial but at the time was using anki but when the great script breakage happened I went back and realized my trial died a couple of years earlier…nec reset my trial and I was able to get my migration working and bought a lifetime to kitsun!

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I have access to several paid services (work subsidy so I get to play around).

WK is very effective. It does teach kanji in a well structured manner. The gatekeeping, while it has some negatives, also tries to ensure you do not overwhelm yourself - something very easy to do in other systems. So would I say that WK is worth subscribing to? Absolutely.

Is it the only kanji learning app worth subscribing to? No. There are others.

I do both MaruMori and WaniKani. In part because I started WK first and my sub is still active , and in part because WK has been working well for me.

But I also learn well from MM too. And MM has the ability to set your own pace (at your own peril if you take on too much), take on additional vocab lists (similar to JPDB), has a grammar SRS (like Bunpro but personally I prefer MM’s hints), has a variety of trainers such as a conjugation trainer, a kanji lookalike trainer, an intransivity trainer - these are quizzes/minigames that you can use to drill things in. And they are planning on more features and trainers. They also have mock exams which do link back to the grammar lessons relevant to the questions you got wrong.

MM has less mnemonics, though you can add your own for the ones that are missing, and they are working on adding more.

I think try both out. If you like WK more, you can use Bunpro and JPDB or other tools to create that same comprehensive experience. If you like MM more, then use MM. If you like both and you have money to spare, you can join the club of people doing both - and yes there are quite a few of us.

And these are by no means the only combinations. I’m also subscribed to NativShark, which is an excellent grammar and vocab/listening site with a rigid unskippable curriculum. There are quite a few people in that community that do NS + WK for their grammar + kanji drill combination.

Actually before MM my combo was NativShark (grammar, short native listening) + JapanesePod101 (1-5 minute listening), and WK (kanji drill) and I truly felt it was an amazing combination. To be honest I didn’t need to add MM, but I felt it would make a great review hub to review content I learned across those three platforms, and it had better grammar explanations than JP101 (which is not a good grammar source, and personally I prefer to learn grammar from 2 sources because I find it helps. So NS + MM really complement my needs better as a person who plans on taking the JLPT where I really need to fully understand the grammar points)

Ultimately you’ll just have to try things out, and keep in mind that lots of products can work, it’s just about what fits you best.

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I’m not exactly sure what you mean. You don’t really need any foundation to do wanikani specifically since you are basically just seeing kanji and words in isolation.

nWanikani itself is like its own foundation where once you begin reading stuff outside of it you might not have to look up every word in the dictionary, saving you time and letting you read more.

I guess if you look at the example sentences in wanikani itself and already know some basic grammar, they might be easier to understand and you can just focus on seeing the word in context.

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Thank you again for sharing your insights.

yes, the example sentences with each vocabulary are a great help to practice grammar with kanji simultaneously.

Thanks a lot for these tips.

Very good @whiterainx . I like how you explained WK method to reinforce the learner’s memory overtime.

You probably saw my other question here… I am curious how you built your grammar while learning kanji at WK, which does not include direct grammar SRS?

@Squintina Thank you for sharing your Japanese language learning journey in this detail …what I resonate with the most is having a comprehensive experience (kanji + grammar) for the ultimate goal to pass the JLPT tests.

I like your description of the NativeShark for grammar and listening aspects…

I believe there should be one source that can have a comprehensive all in one experience (i.e. SRS: grammar + kanji + mirroring JLPT levels)…I understand all sources can improve inthis direction; this requires them to raise fees (I understand this is outside of the topic).

For MM, I am experimenting the trial subscription now… from your discussion, it seems that mnemonics is a potential shortfall for M despite of all MM’s great features, making WK’s rigorous kanji practice stand out. I am curious to learn more about your insight on MM’s kanji experience.

I’m currently using Bunpro for grammar for individual grammar points and Cure Dolly (on Youtube).

Cure Dolly for more conceptual and overarching ideas for how we should be approaching Japanese grammar while trying to remain as language agnostic as possible.

Bunpro for the actual grammar points themselves which are curated by JLPT level. I appreciate the order of N5 to N1 with regards to fundamental concepts working towards more complex combinations of those concepts. N1 is built of your N2 knowledge, N3 your N4 knowledge and N4 built of your N5 knowledge.

However with Bunpro comes a lot of reading overhead, so I would recommend considering starting it at around level 15 to 20 of WK just so reading each of the items doesn’t feel so bad and slow.

Bunpro is also a paid service similar to WK, if you would prefer free resources, Game Gengo (also on Youtube) has a great videos for grammar while showcasing real world examples taken from games.

I would recommend starting with Cure Dolly first, her voice might be initially off putting but I have yet to find another resource that breaks down grammar and explains it as simply as well as she does.

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@whiterainx I appreciate your insights on how to complement WK with Bunpro to gain a meaningfully broad learning experience.

I am curious if you have encountered any “leech management” constrains as you seem to have advanced through WK levels… this is a major shortcoming that WK forums highlight. Any insights on this?

Thank you.

So the reason I mentioned the mnemonics is that I have noticed some are missing and I know a lot of people on WK and MM use mnemonics. Keep in mind that for the ones missing in MM you can make your own and save them, and actually making your own can be better for retention. You can even overwrite existing ones with your own.

But the reason I wrote “a lot of people…use mnemonics”, and not my own experience with mnemonics, is because…… I don’t use mnemonics! On either WK or MM! I do read the list of radicals, and I try to locate them on the kanji, and sometimes I might read the mnemonics (rarely) but I make 0 effort to use them. And this isn’t just because I’m in an advanced stage, even when I was a little nooby I only used mnemonics for things I got wrong over and over again, as an absolute last resort.

And I haven’t felt it has hurt me at all. So my kanji learning experience has been good on both sites. If I didn’t already have WK and wasn’t already so far in, I would probably be on MM only for my Kanji needs.

But since I have both I view it as extra practice - I do NOT use the sync. I think because I don’t use mnemonics I need more practice, but it means once I’m reading actual native content I’m more likely to instantly recognize stuff rather than slow down to think of mnemonics. And I don’t want to waste precious test time once I take the JLPT trying to remember mnemonics.

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If I had to limit to 1 platform, I would take grammar exercises/mini-games, first (not exactly SRS). And then, try to keep daily immersion streak. Maybe even 5 minute daily streak. And then self-study (study skills) to make use I can recall vocab and Kanji (not using SRS is an option, even if you will forget something). A digital sophisticated platform isn’t a must for everything (but it can help structure the learning).

Have you ever find mnemonics for grammar in the first place? Studying isn’t limited to mnemonics. Even if you need mnemonics, those don’t need to be predefined. In the end, try to better at learning.

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Thank you for this wonderful insight. It’s definitely helpful.

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Leech management is still a rather large issue for WK as previously mentioned. However, I haven’t really had too much problems with leeches as they usually sort themselves over time. Big caveat here is “over time” might mean 1 year or even 5 years (I’ve had leeches that I’ve only recently burnt even after being post-60 for almost a year now).

They are a way smaller percentage of your reviews that most people think. It just feels like there’s a ton because you breeze through the non-leeches so they aren’t front-of-mind.

Large wall of text below describing my leech squashing process

After dealing with leeches throughout my WK journey I’ve found a method for managing leeches but it requires usage of some scripts.

I use the Item Inspector script to help identify my leeches. I usually consider anything that has been answered wrong more than 10 times to be a leech. I also go by feel whenever there is an item that constantly bothers me (i.e. I keep making the same exact mistake), I consider a leech as well.

Now that I’ve identified my leeches, I check what type of item it is.

If it’s a radical (blue), I’ll review the mnemonic and really try to see (imagine) the image in the radical. At higher levels, the kanji method below will be more relevant since some kanji will become radicals.

If it’s kanji (pink), I’ll revisit the radical and mnemonic for the kanji to see if I just forgot what it was. More often than not that’s the case. In other cases, sometimes the kanji mnemonic just doesn’t stick so I’ll try to think up something that’s more memorable for me. If the kanji already happens to be burnt, I’ll also consider reviving it to have even more reviews for it.

If it’s vocab (purple), It’s usually because I’ve forgotten one of the kanji within the vocab. Therefore, I revisit the kanji and do the process described above. If it’s a word with a kunyomi reading, usually the issue is the mnemonic itself for that word. If that’s the case, I’ll also try to think up a better mnemonic.

Now if after all this, the leech still really bothers me, I will check how frequent the word is with JPDB, and decide whether to just leave it be or “remove” it from the queue. An example of this is the word 由来 (origin) it’s been bothering me since November 2021 (almost 6 years!) and I still keep getting it wrong. However, this is a rather common word at 6k frequency, so I decided not to “remove” it from my queue and just let it sort itself out (or export to Anki).

As a second measure, the item inspector script lets me export my leeches to Anki, and I do extra reviews there, save for the most stubborn items, this clears most of the of the leeches.

Now if I feel that I will never encounter that word in my life, I use this Item Filter script to answer that item correctly all the way to burned. I’ve found that this is the only script that works for “removing” bothersome items. However this is an extreme last resort and over all the items in WK, I’ve only ever done this 10~ or so times.

From my experience, most leeches are due to a “misreading” (and thus misremembering) of the kanji, that is, thinking one kanji is something else, mainly stemming from one misread radical. Another cause will be due to mnemonics not sticking and being too simple to be memorable.

Something like misreading radicals in 織 (weave) and 識 (discerning) they both use the 戈 (drunkard) and 音 (sound) radicals but differ with the 糸 (thread) and 言 (say) radicals. As one gets used to WK, they might glaze over this minor difference every time they see it (complacency/routine) and always get it wrong. If they don’t break it down, the item becomes a leech and creates frustration every time it’s seen. Another example is 白 (white) and 自 (self), if you look at these very quickly in a rush to finish your reviews, you might mistake one for the other. Again, this stems from the “misreading” issue and simply requires that you pay more attention to the review.

The best way I’ve found to alleviate this is to take your time looking at the items, as well as the Confusion Guesser script. This script will try to show you the radical/kanji/vocab you might have gotten confused with.

Further, I feel that mnemonics are essential training wheels for our brains to recognize a set of strokes as words/concepts the same way we see letters. If we take them off too soon, we run the risk of totally blanking on an item with no “breadcrumbs” to follow to recall it.

I realize that this seems like a rather long winded method to deal with leeches but realistically you won’t really have to apply this method all too often, and once you get used to it this is a rather quick process.

I could just move platforms, but without WK, I wouldn’t know as much kanji and vocab as I do now, even if I used stuff like Anki, etc. Their curated ground up approach and sheer amount of content outweighs their lack of leech management. While yes, I would very much love a way to deal with leeches officially, it is what it is, and my method works well enough for me.

The real short answer to kill leeches is frequency, the more stubborn the leech, the more often you should see it. If the word isn’t that important to you, just forget it and move on, and if at all you see it again, you are allowed to use the dictionary in the real world to see the reading/meaning.

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@whiterainx Thank you very much for sharing your leech management methodology in this detail. It is certainly very useful with all of the tools you mentioned, such Item Inspector script, JPDB, Item Filter script, Confusion Guesser script, etc.

This is very insightful.

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It’s a great explanation and I would also like to add that personally it also gives me a “crutch”, as in it’s so easy and automated, that it is also the thing I can keep doing, even if I am burned out or lazy. I will keep doing my reviews or lessons (even though I could reduce the rythm), no matter what happens.
And then the better I feel, the more I add onto it: grammar, reading, listening, etc.

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Don’t. What you buy with WaniKani is a set of mnemonics predicated on the theory that memorizing cute stories about cute characters will make it easier to memorize the kanji.

The problem with WK’s mnemonics, which you’re supposed to be memorizing, is they change them, constantly, for asinine reasons. For example, a bunch of characters got renamed because someone felt there wasn’t enough female representation among their fictional characters; others because they decided to redesign their (invented) radicals.

There’s a change log somewhere on the forums; go take a look at it. They’ll never add content to Wani Kani, especially not anything that’d be useful for JLPT exams, but your subscription will fund someone who’s full-time job is to rewriting whatever you already memorized to remove anything fun or memorable.

The WK forums are a bad place to ask this question, though. You’ll hear from WK superfans–the only people who would hang out in a WK forum–and not from anyone who ditched the service for anything else. I was summoned by one of the Look At These Forum Posts e-mails WK sends to tell you my lifetime purchase was a mistake.

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Broadly your take is fair enough (when I used the site this sort of change never effected me a single time; maybe I got lucky), but this part just isn’t true. If you hang around you’ll find that the forums have quite a lot of people who never used WK and don’t care at all about it because this serves as a pleasant community of Japanese readers and source of community events and clubs. I give WK some shit myself (I even sorta lightly recommended against it in this thread) but I do like that the mods definitely let the people hang around who primarily complain about WK.

That said, the complaining has died down over time and many of those who are here for other purposes thus spend their time in the non-WK specific parts of the forums. But I’ve never seen anyone use WK and fail to learn if they put in the time really, so yeah you’ll just get positive responses cause people did indeed learn. To me, the biggest risk are the people who don’t “leave the nest.” It’s really common, and I sometimes wonder if the fact WK curates everything and makes it easy for you encourages people to get too comfortable and never move on. To their credit, WK does tell you you need to after. It could also just be drawing people more likely to not want to go to the uncomfortable parts, or it could be that this happens everywhere at a similar rate. I don’t know.

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I’ve been living in Japan for 10 months attending Japanese Language School here. The only reason I’m anywhere good at Kanji and knowing the readings is because of Wani Kani. The school I’m attending doesn’t break down radicals, or the different readings. They just expect you to memorize it. If it wasn’t for Wani Kani I’d be struggling much more than I already here in Japan.

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