hey there, I’m struggling to understand the meaning of the word 落ち, both the english and japanese translations of it that I could find were a bit confusing to me. Can anyone provide an explanation?
The main translation that WK provides is “conclusion” but the japanese 意味 and sentences containing it gave me the feel that it’s used differently than I thought, like this one:
Edit: how do you even translate the last one? I would say “the action/situation/? of taking flight from that ground”. it seems like describing the actual contrary of the kanji meaning itself which means “fall down”. Side question on this: how do you translate “その地”?
I’ve only really seen two usages of this. one basically covers the meanings of a punchline to a joke or the reveal of a plot twist. the other is to say that something’s been missed out or overlooked
it’s got a few other usages that aren’t really related though, are you trying to unify those or something?
I would personally translate it as “Running away/fleeing from that place” but realistically that use as a suffix is only used with 都落ち that I know of. There are some other words that are compounds of ochiru too that mean running away like 落ち延びる. There was another one too that I knew that I can’t seem to remember, but I don’t really feel like looking for it right now since it won’t add any value regardless.
yeah its fine
Your best bet is just trying to understand definition 3 because its probably the most common use by a big margin. Its just the end of something, often a joke.
Honestly no, this makes a lot more sense than the others
ohhh okay now it’s clear. I never thought about 地 as “place”, I only knew its “ground”, “earth” or “territory” meanings which all felt weird in the sentence.
Yeah I’m fine with it, even tho why is it hidden at number 3
Japanese J-E dictionary are pretty good for that btw. For example from the Kenkyusha:
落ち
4 〔結末〕 the end; the outcome; the upshot; the final ┏result [issue]; the denouement; 〔落語の末尾のしゃれ〕 the ┏point [punch line] 《of a joke》; 〔物事が行き着いた先の意外な[面白い]話〕 an unexpected ending; the rub; the twist (at the end of a story).
►話の落ち the twist in a tale.
►(結局)…となるのが落ちだ result [end] in…; end up 《as…, being…, doing…》; lead to…
・訴えても物笑いになるのが落ちだからやめとけ. Even if you sue, you’ll only ┏end up being laughed at [come away a laughingstock], so don’t do it. ｜ Even if you sue, the only result will be that people will laugh at you, so don’t do it.
・ああいう上司ではせっかく進言してもどなられるのが落ちだ. With a boss like that, whatever constructive comments you make the only upshot is that you ┏get told off [come away with a flea in your ear].
►その落語の落ちがわからない. I ┏miss [don’t get, fail to catch] the point of that joke.
・その話には落ちがついている. The story has an unexpected twist of events at the end. ｜ There is a surprise ending to the story.
Different dictionaries have different standards. I know Kojien orders them by historical usage, so often the first definitions can be unhelpful classical meanings.
I’m mostly relying on such google search to look up Japanese definitions up and it’s not the first time I get a weird definition presented (in the way that it’s not coherent with the most common vocab translations), so I would say that google is not good for this and it’s better weblio or kotobank?
For typical definitions of typical words, it really doesn’t matter. For example, 落ち’s definition that was relevant for your question would be available anywhere really. But for more niche things or very specific use cases, I often would check with multiple dictionaries if I felt like I wasn’t find exactly the definition I wanted. Just be careful because for google you have to expand to see all definitions usually.
I use Goo quite often, for instance, however it does tend to miss some entries found in jisho.org. In terms of definitions, it hasn’t let me down so far.
So, you walk into a convenience store and buy some manner of bento or other meal. The guy behind the counter asks if you’d like him to warm it up for you. My question: what exactly is the standard phrasing for this question?
(Just asking because every time they asked me this on my latest trip, I completely failed to catch it, and they’ve had to fall back on gesturing at the microwave. So I figured perhaps I should practice it some. Maybe it won’t help, because my listening ability still sucks, but maybe it will.)
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