Teasing Master Takagi-san 😝 ・ Volume 1, chapter 1

Thanks, I’ll definitely look it up. And thanks to all the replies, they were helpful.

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I should have mentioned that I’m not sure how important it is to understand the differences between する and やる (at least at my level of Japanese), I gave the link mostly because I didn’t trust myself to try communicate my limited understanding on any of the subtle differences.

When writing Japanese I (so far) stick with する.
When reading Japanese I (so far, I think) can mostly conflate them (+/- minor assertive/ruder/stronger differences).

If anyone else disagrees, please respect their opinion over mine =D

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I don’t know the answer. At first I thought it was the さ-nominaliser, turning “complete” into “completion”, but I’m wrong because 完成 isn’t an adjective, right? The さ-nominaliser is for adjectives.

So is it the さ sentence ending particle? Must be.

But I don’t actually know for sure!

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I think it must be that. If you look at the example sentences you see that だ often seems to be left out before さ.

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Thank you!

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Thanks for the explanation. This is the tipping point that finally broke me. After considering everything I've learned in the one month that I've been studying Japanese grammar, I finally know what to do with my previously acquired Indo-European knowledge about how language is structured, and what the fundamental parts of speech can even be or do.

Dumpster

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Welcome to the club :joy: :partying_face:

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Thanks. O(∩_∩)O I tried to start my reading with whatever manga my local book store happened to have in stock. That’s proven to be suboptimal for immersion and grammar acquisition… hehe

Buying a digital copy of Teasin Master Takagi-san now. :slight_smile:

EDIT*: Hold up you meant the expression, not just the literal book club… glad to be in both!

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Hi! On page 9 it says 子供っぱい事しないよ。I’m guessing it means “I don’t do childish things” but what is the っぱい doing? Thanks!

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Haha yeah, the moment you’re like ‘welp, none of my grammar knowledge works here!’ is when you start understanding things! :grin:

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:slight_smile:

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It’s very nice to have several people combing through the same text. A few of my questions were already answered, and a few more beyond. Feels very proactive.

p3 (panels 3-6)

ゆがんじゃったのかなー、
I wonder if I (messed/warped) it up, (NB: じゃった → unintentional; かな → “I wonder if”, かな → informal question)
ちょっと西片あけてくんない?
Hey Nishikata, can you open it?
あ、うん。
Ah, sure.
なんだ、簡単にめく。。。
Huh? It opens easily…
!? うわあ!!!
Whoa!!!

p4

なんだ西方。
What is it Nishikata?
な、なんてもありまぜん。(Q: I assume なんても vs なんでも is merely colloquial?)
I-it’s nothing.
くっくっく。
(Laugher)
西方ってホントいい反応するわー。
Your reaction was so good. (NB: って topic particle; ホント → 本当; わ → soft feminine marker)
う、うるさいなっ。
Shut up. (NB: Ending っ → hmph sound)
くそ。。。また、まんまとやられた。
Shit. She got me again. (NB: まんまと → thoroughly)

p5 (panels 1-2)

しかもオレがやろうとしたことを先に。。。
Still, she did the thing I tried to do first. (Q: Can someone break down this sentence? The way が and を are placed made me think it was a simple sentence when it’s actually a complex sentence.)
そもそも高木さんがオレに助けを求めるなんておかしいんだ。
In the first place, the fact Takagi-san asked me to help her was (suspicious/not right).
そこで気づけよオレ。。。
Then, I should have known…
さすが高木さんだ。
As expected of Takagi-san.

Question recap:

  • Is the difference between なんても vs なんでも merely colloquial?
  • Can someone break down this sentence please? しかもオレがやろうとしたことを先に
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Thanks didn’t even know that さ-nominaliser was a thing did only notice it in some vocab. But さ sentence ending particle makes sense to me. Thanks for explaining.

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If you look it up in ichi.moe you’ll find that it is from ゆがむ and that it means ‘warp’ in an intransitive sense (‘vi’ means ‘verb intransitive’). So it’s not that she thinks ‘she has warped it’, but that ‘it warped’. I recommend you take a look at this video, I think it explains it amazingly well. If you turn on the captions and set it to 1.25x the android voice is just about bearable :wink:

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Thanks for catching up my mistakes! ^w^
And Cure Dolly’s voice isn’t that bad :3 The quality content makes up for it in spades

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have doing reading before and with beginner book club found lots of people were too afraid to ask questions…haven’t had any yet myself with this book…but most of these I have had at one point in time… it’s great to see everyone posting up all questions no matter the level of difficulty…it really helps build something useful for everyone for all levels… keep up the good work!

and of course our superstar folks that explain everything…rockstars through and through… :star: :star: :star: :partying_face: :partying_face: :partying_face: Sometimes I’m a bit jeaous though…I wish I could explain things as clearly and as well as you folks! :wink:

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I’m reading this with my friend at the moment, it’s quite fun, quite sweet! Look forward to the rest

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Here's an extra breakdown of the 「ゆがんじゃったのかな」 part.

As @Phryne mentions, the verb a contracted form of ゆがんでしまった.

It’s formed by:

  1. Starting with the verd 「ゆがむ」 (to bend).
  2. Adding て so you link another verb. In this case, since the first verb ends in む, we get で, resulting in 「ゆがんで」.
  3. When we add しまう to the て form of a verb, it can give the sense that something happened unintentionally. You didn’t mean for it to happen, but it did.
  4. Next, we add た to show the action is a complete action (similar to past tense in English), so that しまう because しまった.
  5. And finally, colloquially (when spoken), the でしま tends to come out as じゃ, leaving us with ゆがんじゃった.

We add to this the “explanatory の” mentioned earlier in this thread. This is used when one observes a result, and is stating or inquiring as to the cause. The result here is that Takagi finds that her pencil box won’t open. The cause of why the pencil box is unable to open is unknown to her (or, at least, that’s the impression she’s giving). Thus, when she speculates as to the reason why, as to what the cause of this situation is, she adds の to it. (There’s a lot more going on in the grammar, but this covers the basic meaning without going into the details.)

This changes the sentence from "It has bent to “Ii is that it has bent / is it that it has bent?” or “it is because it has bent / is it that it has bent?” But how do we know whether it’s a statement or a question? If someone is providing an explanation, it’s a statement. If they are seeking explanation, it’s a question. (We do similar in English, where we use a statement as a question.)

You can tell whether it’s a statement or a question because the latter has rising intonation when spoken. Well, that doesn’t help us since this isn’t some fancy “audiobook manga”. Instead, we have to use context. Which makes more sense? For Takagi to state why it won’t open as if she knows the reason, or for her to inquire as to why it won’t open because she doesn’t know? The latter makes more sense.

In this case, however, we have an extra clue. The かな. As you wrote, かな means “I wonder”, but it that か is what’s used to ask questions. Adding な gives the sense that the question is a guess. “I wonder if (statement).”

This takes our “It is that it is bent”, and turns it into “I wonder if it is that it has bent”. Note that these English translations are missing the “explanatory の” and the “unintentional しまう” because these don’t translate well to English. We can try to shoehorn them in, and in some cases that works, but in other cases the English comes out as sounding convoluted. Once you start to internalize Japanese concepts that translate directly into English, you’ll find you’ve made a big step in understanding Japanese as Japanese, without having to filter it through English first.

Further reading:

Here, Takagi is using わ after する. A plain form of verb, such as する, has kind of an abrupt sound when ending a sentence with it. You can “soften” the sound at the end of your sentence by adding わ to the end.

Try saying 「する」 and 「するわ」, and notice how the first ends more abruptly and the second ends more softly.

I’m not certain about the “emphasis” nature of it. Anything I read about わ mentions “emphasis”, but I don’t have a feel for what that means with わ.

This is one you’ll get a feel for over time, because you’ll see it a lot. If you read aloud lines that end in っ, you may get a better feel for it. Often times English translations replace the っ with an exclamation point, but that’s not always the case.

There's a few things going on here.

First, let me write it in a way that shows an inner clause:

「しかも『オレがやろうとした』ことをさきに…」

The word こと refers to a “thing”. But it’s not a tangible (physical) thing. It’s an intangible thing, like a concept.

To know what the concept is, you need to look at the clause that is modifying it:

『オレがやろうとした』

Here, the subject (the one doing an action) is オレ (“I, me”). The verb やる (to do) is in the volitional form やろう (“intend to do”), and when we add とした (と+the completed/past tense form of する), it gives the sense of “tried to do” or “was about to do”. (There’s more to learn on the grammar here, but there basics are enough to keep from overwhelming all in one reply!)

This gives us this clause, this embedded sentence as “I was about to do”.

Remember, this is modifying こと, so the conceptual “thing” that this こと means is “the thing of what I was about to do”.

「しかも『…』ことをさきに…」

“Moreover (しかも), (did unspoken verb) with こと (‘the thing I was about to do’) ahead (さきに)”

“Moreover, before I could do the thing I was intending to do…”

As @Phryne says, なんて is trouble for learners of Japanese.

I like to consider that this なんて is connected to a whole clause:

「そもそも『高木さんがオレに助けを求める』なんておかしいんだ。」

Here, the “something like” meaning you’ll find in Japanese to English dictionaries applies as:

『高木さんがオレに助けを求める』なんて ⮕ something like 『高木さんがオレに助けを求める』

“To begin with (そもそも), something like Takagi-san requesting assistance from me is odd.” (Plus a のだ written as んだ at the end for good measure.)

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Case in point, I think your explanation does it a lot more justice :grin:

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I think this is the sentence-ending particle さ used for assertion. It’s typically used by male, and gives a sense of confidence. So, rather than just saying to himself “it’s complete”, he’s asserting confidence.

I think that explanation may be serviceable, but I find it’s one of those things you really get a feel with exposure over time. I don’t know how often we’ll see this さ in this manga, but keep an eye out for it just in case!

Yup, that’s about right. This is why a lot of English language textbooks on learning Japanese (such as Genki) get criticized: they shoehorn Japanese grammar into English grammar rules.

Visualization of English textbooks teaching Japanese grammar.

giphy-downsized

If you’re on digital, would you believe this manga’s release is one of the better ones on image size and text clarity?

i-0007x

I’ve been working at explaining things for nearly 15 years now. I think I’m finally almost starting to get just a little bit good at it! (Maybe that’s not the most inspiring way to say it…)

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