Pace too Slow for Intermediate Learners (?)

WaniKani
#7

The minimum time per level 7 days and change. A lot of people have done that. If it’s taking you 8 or 9+ days per level, then quite frankly you are not going at maximum pace.

If you’ve already mastered the lower level material then your reviews should be blazingly quick and easy and it should take very little time out of your day, so I don’t see what there is to complain about. If not, then you haven’t mastered them.

Even if the WK stuff is pretty easy in the early going, there’s so much more studying you can be doing with your time. Grammar, listening practice, speaking, writing… enjoy the time while it’s low workload :slight_smile:

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#8

It sounds like

  1. you have a lot of free time
  2. you have a hard deadline (~3 months)
  3. you appreciate WK for what it is, just not how it fits in your current situation

In that case I would probably stick with WK as a supplementary source and revision aid with long term goals in mind, but probably look into cramming using other methods like this or this to make use of that free time. If you’re the programmer type you could also do something like use the api/scrape items and use that to go through the content at an accelerated pace (but that’s kind of a dick move yo). Alternatively, since you’re around the N4+ level you could always try reading a lot. There are options like satori reader, japanese io, or kitsun that can do a good job of integrating readers with an SRS platform (or use anki, whatever). I think that would be a more organic and useful approach in the long term, but kind of bad for testing purposes.

Either way, the responses here are too busy extolling WK’s virtues to point out that at a level a week max, you can’t hit your goals with WK alone or by trying to be efficient in your learning path. Since WK is too slow for you right now, do other things to use your energy. You can always back off or cut out what you don’t need to spend time on later.

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#9

The first levels are slow but you can use the time between two reviews to self study! I feel like WK reviews are a great way to put you in a “learning mood” :books:

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#10

It doesn’t sound like WK fits your current needs, so I suggest you go with Anki or another alternative. In 3 Months, you’ll only reach a minimum of level 14, If I were to guess.

Edit:
I don’t normally recommend this, but it might do it for you. There’s a script that allows you to skip vocabulary, and just do the Kanji (and Radicals, obviously). Try it out, if you don’t care about Vocab.

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#11

Hello, I also started WaniKani as a lower intermediate learner, so I know where you’re coming from.
If you go at a good (but not crazy fast) pace you should be around level 12/13 by the end of August. That means you will know most of N5/N4 Kanji and 1/3 of N3 Kanji, in addition to some N1 and N2 Kanji. If you’re already lower intermediate then you will know all these Kanji really well by that time and it will definitely help you in the placement test.

Before, I felt like I knew most of the Kanji, but after doing the first levels of WK I finally feel those basic 400ish Kanji are really burned in my mind. At around level 14-15 things will start ramping up really fast and you start wishing that things were actually slower :slight_smile: And by this time, it will actually aid you in your university studies.

Also remember that you will be acquiring some vocabulary along the way, so even in the earlier levels I felt like I was learning something, even though I knew 90% of the content.

Since you are on a tight timeline, it may be beneficial to use other methods to reinforce what you’re learning, but if you just cram everything it probably won’t be good for long-term learning. That’s why I would still recommend you sticking to WK so you can continue learning for the long term.

Now that I’m at level 35 after about 9 months, I can start reading more advanced books and materials and I don’t feel overwhelmed when I pick up a random book or I look at a news article. There’s still a ton to learn, but I feel like I covered most of what is needed to be functional without being overwhelmed and that’s probably a quicker learning than you’d get in 8-9 months at any course.

Hope this helps!

EDIT: I am assuming from your post that you’re hoping to be placed at a N3 class. As in, a class that you’re learning the N3 contents… and not to have passed N3… If that’s the case, WK will still be helpful, if you need to know all of N3 contents, then you will be far from that goal.

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#12

Read through the guide that @Rihn posted: My Journey of 368 days (+ The Ultimate Guide for WK 📖 )

It’ll show you how to achieve max speed.

The key is the 3 per day review split in order to catch the first two apprentice reviews on the same day.

Honestly though, if you have a set date that you need to hit, it would probably be better to keep to an 8 or 9 day per level pace and spend time on other studies.

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#13

I’ll deffo look into the scripts and see if they’re something I can wrap my head around. Coding has always been a bit beyond me and I actually dropped out of uni the first time I went after basically failing my class in AI coding :sweat_smile: (though that had a lot to do with our programme leader forgetting to actually put us in for our basic coding class that was supposed to go alongside it). If it just requires me to be a bit of a copy-paste code monkey I should be ok :joy:

Obviously we all have our different experiences with WK but its still nice to hear from others. Long term its my hope that my WK account will be in that position where I’ve covered the kanji that I have in real life (like you) and can just flick through it over my coffee as a refresher and use it as that sort of revision aid. My problem is just getting there. Thanks for the advice ^^

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#14

I totally agree with with WaniKani being one of those methods that are just the best for long term retention. I can feel a difference when I’m reviewing the kanji with WaniKani in comparison to me flicking through my little handmade paper flashcards, and I really love the interaction of typing the answers in the reviews. It’s just frustrating to only get to do that for 5-10 mins a day. :sweat_smile:

I think the time frame doesn’t work for my short term goals but I don’t think that means WaniKani won’t work for me in the long term. Officially, I’ve covered about 630 kanji on my degree (although I won’t claim that I’m really confident with remembering all of those) so given that WaniKani has plenty more kanji than that, when I get a bit further along I will definitely be covering plenty of new kanji and it won’t feel so frustrating. In the meantime, I’m loving using it as a revision aid to refresh some of the kanji I’ve already studied but it would just be great if WK would allow me to go faster so I could hit that point where I have enough reviews.

In short I do think WK is a great product but I feel like it could be improved (and would be more valuable to many) with more reviews/day for faster/more advanced learners to bypass/level up kanji they get correct first time around faster.

I think it will still help, and I only lose like 5-10 mins a day - so its not like I’m losing so much by keeping up with it. Its just a shame that I can’t choose to invest more time into WK to progress faster (as I will still be spending the time on kanji just elsewhere).

Will check out your link to see if there’s anything new to learn about the levelling system though I think I get it now in a way I didn’t last year when I first tried WK :slight_smile:

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#15

Genuinely feeling very jealous of those who are ‘drowning’ in kanji later on :joy: Just feel like if there are so many complaints at the earlier stages even amongst those new to kanji, it feels like something is a little unbalanced in the algorithm. I just really wish there was some way for learners to bypass the kanji they already knew meanings and readings of/move them to the later proficiency levels manually/there was a placement test to quickly sort through the kanji you have already covered through prior study etc.

I guess what I was trying to ask was how do intermediate learners who have already learnt a fair number of kanji, who are new to WK maintain their motivation through the slow slog until they reach the point where they’re getting enough/preferably “too many” reviews :sweat_smile:

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#16

Dude, I feel you. I started out the same way. Personally, I get by for now with using KameSame alongside WK to study things that I want and zip past the content in KS that is below me. Also, there are a LOT of helpful WK extensions available if you don’t mind installing the Greasemonkey scripts that can fine-tune WK to your liking.

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#17

I genuinely believe it is an amazing learning tool and when I get to that later point you’re talking about, an invaluable one. I suspect my experience will be very similar to yours in that respect ^^ Its just that painful slog getting to that point that’s bothering me :sweat_smile: I’ve officially covered 630 kanji on my degree (though many are in great need of revising), but obviously they aren’t in the same order as WaniKani’s so I will cover some ones I haven’t seen before, before I do cover all those that I have. There will be plenty of kanji that will be totally new to me throughout my WK journey just perhaps not many anytime soon :sweat_smile: I really look forward to my WK level catching up to my actual level ^^ In the long run I’m sure I won’t regret working through the slog, it’s just the short term I’m struggling through and was hoping others had some advice for maintaining their motivation through that period. I guess just holding on to the knowledge it will help in the long run.

Thank you very much for the well wishes ^^ I wish you the best of luck on your WK quest too~

#18

Thanks, I will check it out ^^ Looks relevant :grin:

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#19

Just a moment ago I got this idea, and I think you can improve this method to fit your need. As a note: this is beyond the WK SRS, you can utilize self-quiz.

  1. Schedule your learning time & item
  2. Do quiz
  3. Schedule your next review based on your preference

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And you have a lot of option on how you can divide the quiz pile, my example is by level and item type. But again, because it’s outside of WK SRS, you need to discipline with your own review time.

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#20

Just a B.T.Dubbs… I used to consider myself intermediate level. I had self studied (rushed) wanikani and studied up to textbooks as Tobira and 上級読解 and found my speaking and listening ability abysmal to my reading ability. A year or two ago I “restarted” and started going through Genki in a small class room environment, while still studying all of my other avenues, anki, iknow, wanikani (restarted), duolingo, and I realized at the end of my small class, how non intermediate I was after doing exercises at the end of Genki 2. My listening is laughable, and speaking is the same. My class made it better for sure. I am probably pretty dumb though. Probably air on that and not worry. Enjoy this slapper, while you bask in the meaning of existence

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#21

I initially thought the pace was too slow, but I think around my level it’s around the pace I want, doing it three times a day. I’m slightly terrified it’ll start going too fast (and have already considered steps to avoid that) but I think the initial pace slowly easing you into it is a good thing and probably stopped a lot of drop outs

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#22

The reviews being ‘blazing quick’ is kind of the problem. Today, when I woke up I only had 1 review session on my forecast and it took literally only like 5 minutes to get through. I get some review sessions that literally only have 5 items that I can do in less than a minute so its kind of a pain because it feels so little. I think that is my complaint if you get me? I sort of want to be able to invest more time in to progress faster but kind of can’t. I’m doing WaniKani daily, as soon as they arrive if I’m sitting in front of my computer when they become available. I think I may have had some typo problems on a couple in the most recent level which seem to have really gotten me behind on this most recent level (and the lack of review frequency causes that to really slow the progression it seems - there’s no chance to redeem the typo).

I do have plenty of other language learning tasks that I’m putting my time into outside of WK, it’s just that I feel like my kanji specific studies are a little neglected and receive comparably less time to say my grammar, vocab, reading and listening practice. It seems for my requirements I’ll just definitely need to use WaniKani as a supplementary revision tool and not a primary one is all and its just a little disappointing because in general I really do enjoy the experience of doing the WK lessons and reviews and just want to be able to use WK a little more.

#23

I think I will definitely be doing that (sticking with WK for the long term and treating it as a supplementary resource whilst using other methods to reach my summer revision goals).

I will read the 2 articles you’ve linked me to and I might look into the accelerated pace thing (sorry if anyone sees it as a dick move but it’s only my own learning it affects, right?).

I’m doing plenty of other things where I’m encountering Japanese in a more organic way, but I’m just trying to find something to help me polish up my kanji knowledge and retention in a more formal manner (it’s what I’m most concerned will place me lower in a placement test atm). I do really enjoy the testing function of the WK reviews for that very purpose, just wish I could do more of them.

#24

I think I will probably use both :grin: In the long run WK will be great I just need to get up to the levels where its more helpful and I’m getting enough reviews. For the short-term I will just have to self study for my placement test.

Several others have been mentioning the different scripts so I’ll look into them. I kinda enjoy seeing the vocab though and I don’t feel like they slow down the reviews of the kanji do they? So I don’t really mind doing them tbh ^^

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#25

the pace eventually gets much much faster for the reviews. I get about 200 a day and I’m literally not even a tenth of the way done with the program.

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#26

You’re only level 2, give it some time. I’m working on level 11 and in the last 24 hours, I have had almost 300 reviews. As your level goes up, you will get more content to review.

Also, as someone pointed out, if the minimum level is 7 days (and a bit), and it’s taking you 8 or 9, the problem is you. Either you’re not doing your reviews exactly “on time”, or you’re making beginner mistakes that push back your reviews, which means you’re not as advanced as you think you are.

I actually like the speed of WK. It’s designed to follow the time at which knowledge is properly stored by your brain. It’s too easy with things like Anki to consume a gigantic amount of content fast, but then quickly forget it after a short while because you can fiddle with settings to review stuff “early”. WK makes you wait, and I like that.

Sure, there’s kanji and vocab I know that are above my WK level, and I do think the order they teach stuff in is a little weird. For example, if I grab my Genki book, the kanji used in day of the week (曜), is the 25th kanji you learn. It’s learned by 2nd year elementary school students. But in WK, you don’t learn it until level 16. That’s how they’ve chosen to do it, however.

If you really feel that stifled by WK then it’s not for you.

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