I'm at a loss for Immersing

Japanese Language
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Hello to everyone who’s reading this, and I apologize for the very long post.

Over the last year and 3/4, I’ve been doing Wanikani daily, reaching level 30 only about two weeks ago. During this time I’ve also picked up Bunpro and Anki and have made steady progress with them too. I’ve also known about Immersion for a long time and how it breaches the gap between having Japanese knowledge to having Japanese ability (MattVsJapan Reference).
Currently, I believe I am at an N4 Level (not official).

I’ve been doing extremely poor immersion over the last year and am very disappointed in myself to a large extent. I have been super inconsistent with reading manga books (in Japanese of course), as well as watching anime and Netflix, and listening to podcasts. Recently (in the last month) I’ve decided to, as much as I can, fully immerse in Japanese content. Whether that’s video games, manga books, etc. I have been doing a much better job at immersing than the last year and 3/4 but I don’t believe my Japanese is improving at all. It feels like 99.5% of words I look up and make flashcards of go straight out the other ear and I still can’t speak to save my life or hear any of the slightly complex sentences that I know I’d be able to comprehend if I read it instead. Honestly, it hurts so much to see that all the effort I’ve put into immersion has given me nothing but disappointment.

Sorry for that sad note above, but I kinda had to get it out. But from here is where I would like some help from the community if possible.

Currently, I believe my strong suits in Japanese are: Reading, Kanji (due to the almighty Crabigator), and Writing. Therefore I feel a little less need to work on these aspects and will be mostly skipping these points for the rest of this post.

What I want to work on: Listening, Speaking, and Vocab.
Vocab typically comes as a byproduct of immersion so I’m also going to mostly skip that aspect for the rest of this post.

My current schedule every day for learning Japanese is:
Wake up around 6-6:30, have breakfast, and go straight into SRS (Wanikani, Bunpro, and Anki), and this typically takes me to around 9-9:30 to finish all SRS.
Immersion for the rest of the day. Immersion for me includes about 20 mins of reading (trying to increase this), and active listening including watching Netflix, anime, and YouTube for about 2 hrs 30 mins. Also a little passive listening throughout the day (iPod Shuffle listening from content I had watched previously). Currently no speaking practice.

As mentioned above in my lack of listening skills, when I am doing active or passive listening, I literally cannot comprehend anything that anyone says, despite knowing a fair share of grammar and vocab. Because of this, I often pull out the Japanese subtitles of the content and I can comprehend about 40% of the content (with no pauses and no looking up words) and about 80% of the content (with pauses and looking up words).

I am on school break until the end of February 2025 and have been attempting to make a schedule to strengthen my weaknesses but I am at such a loss for how I should structure my immersion.

I was wondering if any of you have a schedule that you’ve been following for a long time and has worked extremely well. This could include daily SRS, some reading, some speaking, and a lot of listening. Or, if anyone has ideas on how I could schedule my day for immersion for the next 3 months. Maybe also some tips for being able to comprehend listening a little more :grin:
Literally any help at this point would be so greatly appreciated, and I mean that.

To summarize this horribly structured post (and I apologize in advance),
My immersion journey so far hasn’t been successful at all, as I have many weaknesses that have still been unsolved (specifically my listening ability).
I was wondering if any of you have a daily schedule that I could follow that typically has a lot of listening immersion (active and passive) and how I would structure it, as my attempts at making my own have been futile. Maybe a little speaking practice too.
Furthermore, some tips for increasing my listening ability would also be appreciated (such as how I should watch content e.g. with or without subtitles and/or how many times).

And to whoever has read this post to the bottom, I thank you from the bottom of my heart. I’m terribly sorry for rambling on, but right now I’m truly at a loss and need some guidance. Thank you in advance for any comments, short or long, useful or not, even if they’re just some words of encouragement, any kind of help is truly appreciated.

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When you say you are immersing - what are you immersing in? Is it content where you are looking up 90% of the words, or content where you are looking up only 10-20%? The latter is a lot better than the former, though difficulty is hard to judge - use Natively or similar to help for books.

You’ve only been at this for a month, it’s okay to let stuff breath. It sounds more like you have a motivation issue than necessarily an “I’m not comprehending this” issue, given the timeframe. Find small, achievable goals and track them.

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You seem to do everything right, in fact your dedication to SRS (nearly 2h/day?) and consuming content (hours of listening daily) is impressive.

I’ve been studying Japanese reasonably intensively for over 2 years (so longer than you) and I can’t do that for anything but very simple content. You’re really doing well IMO. You say that you haven’t been “successful at all” but I don’t understand how you can say that if you can understand 80% of the content with lookups. I can assure you that very few people on these forums could do this less than two years into their studies.

I can’t really give you any practical advice given that you seem to be doing better than me, but I can give you a little motivation as someone who’s learned a few other languages before getting into Japanese:

What you’re experiencing right now is normal. Learning any language takes time, learning Japanese takes longer than most. There are highs and lows. If your current routine frustrates you, try looking for something else. Play simpler videogames, read less demanding manga, have fun and don’t be too hard on yourself.

Challenging yourself is good, but sometimes you have to give yourself a break and give you an opportunity to actually have fun with the language. Find some level 20~24 manga on Natively that seems interesting and read that.

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I personally wouldn’t put too much stock in immersion metrics at your level. Literally any amount is fine and you gotta just wean your way into it. I started around the 2 year mark and just said “screw it I need to try” and picked up my My Hero Academia manga and just started reading (with or without any comprehension). Just pick up what you want to read and watch and start a little bit at a time. Make the goal attainable too. If I recall correctly I started out just reading a set number of pages, then chapter, then volumes. For TV just watch something your familiar with already and see what words you can pick up without feeling the stress of not knowing what’s going on (you’ve seen it before afterall). Put on Japanese subs if they’re available to you.

Another method is searching “Comprehensible Japanese” and find something that appeals to you on YouTube.

TL;DR Just start and don’t compare yourself to others. The SRS stuff is enough for now, and doing a little immersion a day is fine.

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One thing I dont notice anywhere in your post that helped with listening the most is YouTube, AKA: native speech. Moreso than any anime, drama, or podcast this has helped me the most because its more often than not unscripted real japanese in applicable contexts that I can determine, theres also always subtitles and tolerating ambiguity tends to be easier for me because there is not some large story to keep track of. If you`d like some reccomendations I could definitely leave a few down below.

Tangential note: I just sat to take N3, have finished WaniKani, and live in Japan, and I am just starting to feel that I can mostly understand simple podcasts and most anime. Immersion for me is much more about getting used to the rhythym and vibes of the language as well as picking up set phrases than it is for me about actively learning 100%.

Additionally, I would reccomend making sure your immersion is FUN! If its not something you genuinely enjoy or are excited to do, chances are you won`t be inheritly motivated to push through to continue viewing/reading it. Hope any of that advice can help you!

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I’m hovering around N1 in about a year and a half of study, quitting WK at level 30 about half a year ago. Have daily conversations with natives with little to no trouble communicating and haven’t really had the need to look up anything while reading native material for a while now.

I’m not saying any of this to brag. The entire time I’ve been studying, I have never, not once, felt like I was really improving all that much. I’d only notice it looking back at old online posts in that language, or looking back at old study notes. Big part of why I’m glad I wrote everything I learned down from the start, it really helped bring perspective in that field. You might be SRSing the same set of words pretty much every day, but a month from now you’re doing the same with a different set or words as they keep slowly phasing in and out.

Especially with SRS, this ended up resonating with me really hard. Even with WK’s leveling system, SRS is kind of a process with no goal in sight for most of it.

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For speaking, I kinda hit this point about a year ago last December where I got the opportunity to join a streamer’s 忘年会 Discord voicecall with about 10 people. And that’s when I noticed I just couldn’t keep up at all. I could follow what people were saying for the most part because I’d done a lot of listening, but at no point could I comfortably join the conversation. So from January onwards I forced myself into conversations with people online, ended up making friends, and a week ago I joined in with a different group’s gathering for a game, a 集会 if you will, and had no issues holding my own despite there being 40 people there. So about a year later or so, I finally noticed I’d actually made real progress, because I sure as hell didn’t really feel or notice it during any of the awkward steps towards that.

What it really comes down to in my experience is that you shouldn’t be too hard on yourself for struggling on output when you’re learning it. You can know everything 100% and will still make mistakes. Your higher proficiency in understanding will make those mistakes more transparent to you, both as you’re trying to communicate, and in hindsight. And because you have a large gap to cover, you will feel like you’re not making progress.

All of this, unfortunately, is part of the process. The only real thing is to keep at it, and remember to have fun with it.

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yo drop the study routine? :eyes:

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No, I quit Wanikani. Not studying itself. I still study about 20 minutes every day consistently, mostly through Anki now.

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I just mean how you were able to get to n1 in a year and a half :open_mouth:

drop as in “post”

please tell me your ways!

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Wanikani and going very hard on immersion for most of it, really. I was around level 10 or so when I pushed myself to read all of Dragon Ball. Took about 2 months at the time, and it was interesting to grow into that level, and then have the work outgrow me as the story would get more serious as complex as it went on. This steady back and forth.

I was maybe 75% ready when I first read Slayers (the light novel) in Japanese as well.

The rest really is just constant communicating with natives, who would often kindly correct me if I made mistakes. I stopped using social media in English around January or so, forced myself to think in the language whenever possible, and things really picked up then.

I don’t really think I’ve done anything especially spectacular outside of spending time on the language every day and maintaining a decent sleep schedule.

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Do you think you could put some of those Youtube recommendations down for me? The only youtube channel I’ve been watching is けーさんとたろー, but maybe some of your recommendations would catch my eye. And also, how often would you typically look up an unknown word that you see in a video? Thanks very much in advance and thanks for the reply!

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One thing that stood out to me is that it seems like you might be upset that you need subtitles to understand anything when you’re listening, but I think that’s not a bad thing, especially starting out. Reading is my strongest skill and listening is my weakest, and so I consumed media exclusively with subtitles for about a year. This was really necessary for me to start to recognize not just the image of the words but also to naturally associate the sounds with the meanings. If you want to speed up that process, I’d say spend 20 minutes every day listening to something without subtitles, then going back and using the subtitles, then listening without subtitles again. And my recommendation is the rest of the time you spend listening, use the subtitles without guilt. There have been studies that show using both audio and subtitles will help you learn the language better in the long run.

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Just some general things about input to think about when you reflecting on your studies.

The big improvement from “immersion” comes not from just engaging in content, but rather a deliberate effort put forth to understand things that you otherwise wouldn’t be able to. So it should look like

Try to do X - > recognize you have failed - > stop and try to figure it out - > learn something new that will assist you next time you see it, or give up and move on if its taking too long

And then if you managed to learn something new that’s useful, your goal is to retain that knowledge. SRS is my favorite choice behind just inputting more .

So if you want to learn to listen better, for example, it doesn’t make sense to just jump in with Japanese subs. You’ll just be reading. Instead, listen to an episode first and repeat certain places, try to hear stuff out and transcribe as best you can, and inevitably fail at certain places. Go back and then watch it with subs, see what you missed, and then relisten without subs to make sure you’re picking it up.

I started listening with wayyyyy more experience than you, and that process alone would sometimes make 20 minute episodes take 40-60 minutes. It’s not glorious, and it’s just a lot of feeling stupid and trying to figure stuff out. I would make sure your immersion has as much as that as you can personally stomach. Maybe you’re already doing that, but I do notice a common mistake being learners underestimating what’s expected of them when inputting in order to get the “big language gains” often talked about.

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I reccomend the most popular youtuber in Japan first and foremost: HikakinTV https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZf__ehlCEBPop-_sldpBUQ

He is kind of like the MrBeast (kind of) of Japan and does a large variety of content such as cooking, tech reviews, gaming, travel, etc. I reccomend him because there is usually something anyone has a passing interest in. You will have to get used to the style of Japanese YouTube (which is admittadly very loud and with constant sound effects, but it really helped me get used to fast speech and natural unrehersed speech.

Additionally there are many famous youtubers like him that often do collabs with him as well such as Hajimeshacho https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgMPP6RRjktV7krOfyUewqw, his brother SeikinTV, and his best friend Masao.

On top of these nebulous reccomendations, I like searching for hobbies I`m interested in and finding the big youtuber in that space. I really enjoy restaraunt reviews and cooking videos and for that I watch https://youtube.com/@ryuji825?si=xW3_etVqNX9g50g1 for cooking and https://youtube.com/channel/UC-km1012mEUQQLGxggmrazw?si=ZaewJjqlB3x1ZIfW respectively.

I also watch this guy who renovates a house DIY style in the Japanese countryside named Inakamon https://www.youtube.com/@inakamon and I watch a lot of different Japanese hip hop content as well because I am personally interested in that.

Theres also this video by one of my favorite Japanese learning channels https://youtu.be/TgGHJeqnucc?si=hcVjtlZadHMfzrWO and he agrees with some of the channels I chose lol . Plus if youre starting to feel a lack of motivation, one of his videos will surely do the trick.

As for when I don`t know words, I think especially at WaniKani level 30 you will know a vast majority, but if I dont know a word and it keeps frequently appearing I usually just pause and try to sound it out into jisho, usually the frequent occurence of the word in the videos after that is enough to commit it to my memory. Some examples that come to mind for me are 超 (super, ultimate) and 登録 (subscribe) I often find what I dont understand the most is small grammar structures, so I do the same with those.

I highly reccomend Hikakins cooking videos https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL95vwsIMiPwL9ssyFlS8-lGrw666t4K_d&si=qNdNFaAJaqrJWwbS and his challenge videos by the way. Also his series where he throws a dartboard at a map of Japan and goes to get ramen and does touristy things in the prefecture. https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL617D-j_ZPXJUVPxraTzv9RHSc3e9oSHw&si=lVYMb47P7_XXY4BH

Hope you can enjoy any of those!

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Additonal advice for youtube:

You probably wont understand everything happening or said in a video, you gotta tolerate some of that ambiguity and just go along with vibes (unless you are trying to have 100% active immersion which I dont reccomend bc you will burnout)

Try to use the title and or description of the video to help with your understanding

Look at the NUMEROUS and BRIGHTLY COLORED subtitles for most Japanese youtube content and use them to help with reading and listening comprehension

There are also whole communities I dont really even engage with (gaming, vtubers, whatever hobby you can think of, etc)

And lastly, some videos youre just gonna watch and barely understand anything thats happening, if it becomes too overwhelming though, just try to find a better video/youtuber. Most of the stuff I watch is like for middle schoolers, but a childlike part of me enjoys seeing stupid food challenges and stuff sometimes lol

(PS Japanese hip hop is an amazing way to train your ear to recognize japanese sounds in quick succession, in my opinion)

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So, I don’t necessarily follow a schedule for listening practice (even though I do a ton of it) and I’m lousy at speaking, so I can’t really speak to those parts of your post.

In terms of listening, I will say that what has helped most for me is repetition and familiarity. I’ve been watching anime for probably more than 2 decades at this point, for much of that time with English subtitles on. Now that I’m actually learning Japanese, I’m re-watching my old favorites with only Japanese audio, no subtitles. The fact that I have a general idea of what is going on already provides context clues that help my mind pick up on words and grammar points I likely would miss with brand new material.

I’m also the sort of person who loves both long, epic series, and re-watching things as many times as possible (major example - I just recently started my 5th re-watch of Detective Conan, an anime with over 1100 episodes and counting. :stuck_out_tongue:). Both of those things are helpful because topics and characters with distinct ways of speaking (slang, particular words or grammar points they tend toward, etc) will often keep popping back up consistently.

I might miss a word or phrase used multiple times in the first couple episodes or even the first full watch-through, but sooner or later, it hits me that I’ve heard the same thing repeated a number of times, at which point I look it up. And from then on, every time I hear it in the show, it acts as a natural SRS - no need to even input it into a flashcard system.

One other note: For me, listening skill has come in waves. For a long time, I felt like I was understanding virtually nothing - maybe a word here and there, but that was it. Then suddenly I was understanding many words, but still feeling like the meaning of the sentences was just out reach, and for another long period of time that was where I stayed. Only just recently (after years of study off and on), I’ve suddenly started grasping complete sentences (albeit relatively basic ones) and even multiple sentences in the same conversation. I expect I will stay at this level for a while, and then suddenly realize I’m understanding complex sentences and full conversations.

I don’t know if that’s a common experience, having long plateaus where you feel like you’re not improving at all, and then something clicks and suddenly so much more makes sense. But that’s how it’s worked for me - if you’re the same, then just keep at it and sooner or later you’ll have that eureka moment and realize you’ve made a ton of progress without even noticing.

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Despite my shortcomings (which I post here regularly) it is one of those things where it’s like I’m miles ahead of where I used to be. It took hours and hours of turning Japanese into a habit and I can pretty effortlessly do things that were actually impossible a mere 5 years ago.

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Thank you everyone for all of the replies.

From what I’ve deciphered from all the comments,
maybe I’ve been thinking of the bigger picture a bit too much, and instead, I need to focus on smaller goals and objectives. These smaller goals could include things such as rewatching a series from a few years back or being able to recognize certain phrases or words I hear often in a series.
Also, I may need to cut down the level of content I’m watching/reading, as having to look up a word every sentence or two isn’t a very fun process. In saying this, I’ll make sure to not only immerse in slightly less difficult content but more engaging for myself too.
Another handy tool I’ve been underestimating is YouTube, as this is likely the most natural Japanese I’ll be able to immerse myself in. Fortunately, many creators add their own subtitles in their videos which may come in handy if my listening ability isn’t on par with their speaking yet.
And on a final point, using subtitles seems like it can be both beneficial and also be an unnecessary handicap. Initially engaging in content without subtitles, then with subtitles, then once again without, could be the best use of my time for language gains.

After reflecting upon everything (and my Japanese journey thus far), I’ve come up with a schedule for myself for the next few months (down below).

It’s 100% imperfect, but I believe it’s a start to get better (specifically listening) Japanese abilities. Feel free to comment on what I could/should change.

Here’s the current plan (including tips for myself)

  • Wake up at 6:00 am and do Passive listening immediately until done with breakfast
  • After breakfast, straight into SRS until fully completed. This includes Wanikani (Reviews + Lessons), Anki (All Decks), and Bunpro (Reviews + 3 Lessons).
  • 10 mins of Japanese Listening Shower as a warmup (no pausing)
  • Reading 30 mins (NHK easy + Manga)
  • YouTube 40 mins (Including 10 mins of Shadowing within the 40 mins through a ‘Japanese Parent’)
  • 1 Anime Episode per Day (Watch 3 Times) This includes:
    1st Watch: No Subtitles
    2nd Watch: Subtitles + Intensive Study (Look up everything and make sure you understand as much as you can and also write down all new words + phrases into a book (as well as putting them into anki))
    3rd Watch: No Subtitles (And shadow as much as possible)
    4th Watch: 3 Weeks Later, watch the same episode with subtitles (Make a calendar note)
  • 9:45 - Listen to Japanese Radio for 30 mins then go to bed
  • Throughout the day, listen to Japanese Podcasts + Radio (via Phone) and content I’ve watched previously (iPod shuffle). Try to get a good balance between both.
  • Be lenient with when you do each activity. As you stay consistent, decrease the leniency.

Once again, thank you for all the replies, it’s made my day a lot better and given me opportunities to better my learning.

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What is your daily amount of time that you are able to dedicate to language learning? Sounds like a lot! :open_mouth:

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Haha, fortunately, I’m on school break for the next 3 months. Gives me all the time in the world to dedicate myself to this life goal.