Hi! I’ve been using WaniKani for awhile. I’m on level 2. I was advised to learn grammar after I know at least 1000 Kanji. I feel like that in terms of the time I’ll spend with WaniKani, it may be a long time. But just to be sure, which level is the point where I learn 1000 Kanji, and is it possible for me to start learning grammar right now? WaniKani has helped cover my kanji/vocab/radical learning workflow, but I don’t have a workflow in place for learning grammar, pronunciation, writing, immersion etc.
I am level 28 and still hasn’t reached 1000 kanji mark. I think you can start right away if you want🧡.
I recommend bunpro for grammar if you feel starting.
Pronunciation in my opinion it is best to ignore it for now same with writing as it might be not that help for beginner(my assumption) that is my humble opinion you can do whatever you want of course.
I don’t know what your idea of immersion but what come to my mind is start using japanese in your daily life or start using japanese media. If so i think you can start by using beginner J-podcasts or watch animes without subtitle (if you are enjoying it)
Also welcome to the community @faizinmotion
If you want to learn it as soon as possible, then just start!
By the way, you’ll reach 1000 kanji at level 30 - but you definitely don’t need to learn that many before starting grammar. 1000 words seems more reasonable to me, but you don’t even need that to start learning grammar. It just makes it easier to understand example sentences when you don’t have to look up every single word
I’ve been studying a textbook for a year without complications before coming here. I strongly advise to start learning at least basic grammar asap.
No need to worry about your kanji and vocab knowledge if you start grammar with a beginner textbook like Genki because they know you are just starting on the language and will not even have kanji in the beginning lessons. Some people still prefer to knock out a few levels of WK before starting on anything else but I have always done kanji,grammar, and vocab at once which I think is most ideal.
Nooo even starting grammar before knowing barely any is better in my humble opinion
Of course it is.
I’m a beginner and learning grammar right from the start has made everything else so much easier. I would say balancing everything has made my progress faster, so I would recommend that.
Also…WaniKani doesn’t teach by the most common words but does it according to the kanji you learn, so maybe start learning the Core 1000 or something.
I hope my advice isn’t bad lol but this is what worked for me
Edit: The title of this is I Want To Learn Grammar ASAP. Do it then!
Where do people get the idea from that you can only start learning grammar when you know (a certain amount of) Kanji?
Most grammar textbooks (if not all) for beginners have furigana. Some grammar textbooks don’t even have Hiragana and Katakana, everything is written in romaji.
Are there even beginner grammar books with Kanji and without furigana if you aren’t idk Chinese?
I’m seriously confused where this idea comes from.
I think it comes from here: Learn Japanese: A Ridiculously Detailed Guide
You should know around 300 kanji and 1,000 Japanese vocabulary words, and your pronunciation should be getting better, or at least you’re being conscious about improving it. Now it’s time to kick Japanese grammar’s butt.
Tofugu gives a pretty detailed justification, but the best summary is:
So when you’re learning grammar with a textbook, coming into it with prior vocabulary knowledge brings you to that 80%. Leaving you just the grammar, which you can then point your laser-like focus towards. Instead of constantly flipping to the index to look up a word or kanji and deal with context switching when you finally get back to the lesson, all you have to worry about is learning the grammar and nothing else.
I did it this way, and have to admit it’s working for me. When faced with example sentences on Bunpro / Tae Kim, etc. I barely have to consult the prior vocab and can focus on learning the grammar.
Obviously I didn’t do it the other way around, so I’m unable to comment as to whether waiting was a good/bad idea
Although I do fundamentally agree with the 80/20 guide for learning basically anything.
That said, find what works for you- there’s no One True Way (unless it’s making tea, where then you should put the milk in first- fight me.)
Waiting until level 10 to start studying grammar does sound a lot more reasonable than waiting until level 30
Personally I dont think it’s a bad idea to focus on WaniKani early on and then slow down WaniKani and get started on grammar.
Obviously, if you have 3h every day for studying Japanese, you could just be doing both
I guess it depends on your learning style and your instinct, really. I started learning from a grammar book before I really knew what kanji was about and how to tackle it. It was nice to be familiar with the components of the language, particles, conjugation etc. But, I don’t suppose it really matters too much. Someone wrote that vocabulary has helped them and I agree, since learning Kanji, when I go into the classroom I know a lot of words and can focus squarely on grammar.
Start as soon as possible
For me, I really enjoyed the JFZ (Japanese from Zero) series on youtube.
It gave me a very nice base to work off of.
I really needed that English explanation sometimes in order to understand.
No offense, but that advice is complete bullplot. I did the reverse of what your advice said. I used to find vocabulary and kanji really difficult (before WK) and so would simply learn the grammar. Because of this, my reading ability was constantly stifled by my lack of vocabulary and kanji.
This brings me to my point: you need BOTH grammar and vocabulary (+Kanji) in order to develop decent ability. Therefore, I suggest you to from mistake and not learn just half the language (even if it is the other half to what I learnt); you would be best advised learning both of them from the beginning, subsequent making steady progress that will be visible in you listening and reading ability.
TL;DR: learn them simultaneously, otherwise one will always be holding you back from your goal.
Recommendations (for grammar):
- Tae Kim’s Grammar Guide
- [SHAMELESS SELF-PROMOTION] GCSE Japanese Grammar Guide.
Noooo! I mean, you can—if that’s what you’d like to do–but it’s not necessary! Like others are saying, you can start learning grammar right away. If someone knows kana then I don’t see why they should wait, to be honest. I spent a few months learning kanji characters before making the jump over to grammar, but I know now that I would have been fine if I hadn’t isolated myself to kanji only for a while.
I worked through Genki to give myself a start into Japanese grammar (after a brief stint with Tae Kim), and any kanji I needed to know was supplied in the textbook anyway. Knowing some of that kanji in advance helped a little bit, but it wasn’t a necessity at all. You can always pair whatever grammar path you head down along with WaniKani, too. They don’t need to (and imo shouldn’t) be separate things, and in fact it’s natural to learn kanji alongside grammar anyhow.
I’ve currently moved on to Tobira and like to use WK to give my kanji and reading skills a boost, and even at my low WK level (5 atm) I can already see improvements. That said, I don’t need WK or other outside kanji resources to work through Tobira (aside from an online dictionary), and I didn’t need them for Genki.
Please, start grammar as soon as you like!
No offense but
and you joined… 1 day ago, according to your forum profile. Since you’re level 2 I guess that means you first visited the forum 1 day ago and signed up for WaniKani a little before that but still, I think it’s fascinating how much WaniKani has helped you after so little time!
Not that I would generally disagree with what you said btw
Haha, yes indeed. I had tried WK up to level three on another account to which I lost access. But, of course, after that I had to start paying and at the time it was simply too expensive. This year though, I decided to take advantage of the winter sale.
At the moment I already know the kanji Iam going through, however I am already learning new vocabulary. (That just highlights how poor my vocabulary was beforehand though)
Working back through WK now has just reminded me of how useful it is.
Once you start learning grammar, you’ll want to find a way to be exposed to it, such as through reading or listening to native material. But it can be difficult when the native material is 98% grammar you haven’t learned yet.
One option is to join the Absolute Beginner Book Club, either by reading the current book, waiting to join the next one, or picking a previous book to read through. You get the advantage of vocabulary lists and discussion, the latter often covering various grammar. Plus you can still ask questions on the book club threads for previously read books/manga.
Ah I see that makes sense. I suppose because I’m used to learning vocab and grammar together from learning different languages in school and in different language schools I didn’t think of that reasoning. Also I find it much easier to learn vocab in context.
The milk first or last debate (no matter if it’s with tea or cereal) is really dividing society I personally add milk later. But I learned that adding the milk first was very common for poor households as they didn’t have cups that could survive the heat of boiling water so they added the milk first. Anyway I don’t plan to fight you on it
Is it though? The joke is always “Look, he’s weird, he puts milk in before the cereal” and I’ve never encountered people who would do that
Milk after cereal. I’m not an animal
(anyway, i shall stop derailing now )