definitely true! Mostly I have this whole thing disected, but stuck because I can’t figure out the dialect and where it should break…If I knew what this was supposed to be in English I could figure out what the pieces with the dialect were and finish this up…other wise I’d just post a question hehe… I’ll have it figured out Tuesday night at the latest… my instructor will help!
So, I answered this based on my knowledge of で に and を for movement verbs, but then I looked it up to check I wasn’t talking out of my butt, which is why I phrased it that way - is this page just a lie (second paragraph under section 1)?
http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/verbparticles
Edit: ugh, just looked it up in my dictionary, which is where I should have looked in the first place if I hadn’t been lazy.
I knew it didn’t make sense - I even double-checked that 歩く was intransitive because I thought it was weird. Well, that’s the last time I rely on Tae Kim
Hmm, what exactly do you mean? I can see several statements that might give a different understanding depending on how you look at it…
Oops, sorry, just saw this in the middle of editing my previous post.
I mean the sentence “places can also be the direct object of motion verbs such as 「歩く」 and 「走る」”.
As I said in my edit, I’d looked up the use of を with movement verbs specifically because I thought it must be a special use case, but then this page just unequivocally said “places can also be the direct object of movement verbs”, so I was like… guess Japanese is weird?!
That’s just a different を in my opinion
DoBJG defines 4 different kinds of を:
which is the standard “direct object particle of transitive verbs”.
which is the one you just bumped into, I think

And for completeness:
which is similar to から, but it seems you can use から only when the destination is clear.
which I don’t really have a feeling for yet…
No I understand, I’m just complaining that writing about them as if they’re the same thing is not only unnecessary but immensely confusing
Oh now I get you, you mean calling it “the direct object” - yes, that’s indeed an unnecessary complication.
Hehe, yes, that’s what I meant, sorry for being unclear we got there!
Page 8
。。。リナのかたをだくようにしてつれていってくれた。
Is the だくように bit (a) the verb “to hug” and (b) the grammar point ようにする, meaning “to try to; to make sure that”? So something like “giving Rina a hug, she took her along (to the police station)”???
めずらしごどもあるもんだな。
This is just めずらしい and こども, right? It seems like such a weird way of phrasing that. Oho, we have an unusual child! Or is it めずらしい + こと? Then why the も
Now there’s still hope that my grammar elaboration helps somebody else and did not just use up space in this thread
For your questions:
だくように: I think so too. My mental image is something like she places her arm around her shoulder and leads her to the police station, but this is more gut feeling, I don’t know whether だく has this meaning as well.
めずらしごどもあるもんだな: I read this as 珍しいこともあるものだね.
But I’m not exactly sure what all the parts represent
Rough meaning: That is rare. (I guess?)
もの might refer to the situation or to a person (either the woman or Rina).
The も might be the one that gives emphasis, meaning even?
So literally it might be something like This is a person / a situation that even has a rare thing to it.
Happy to be corrected on this one
This is how I read it. Edit: It’s definitely こと.
I think the main problem is that using English grammar terms and concepts for Japanese concepts (as is the case for most learning material teaching Japanese to English speakers) sometimes makes things needlessly confusing.
If you think of を as what the verb is done to, then in the phrase そばをとおった, the verb とおる “to go by”, is done to そば “side”.
Likewise in the DoBJG examples NicoleRauch provided:
- 日本語 is what the verb 勉強している is being done to (language is being studied).
- 五番街 is what the verb 歩いた is being done to (location is being walked).
- 家 is what the verb 出る is being done to (place is being left).
- 死 is what the verb 悲しんだ is being done to (death is being mourned).
In this sense (don’t know if I’ve conveyed it very well), in all cases を is performing the same role.
Japanese dictionaries give different entries for the different uses, just like the grammar dictionary @NicoleIsEnough quoted. I think you’re trying to fit them all into one box like Tae Kim, which I think just makes things more confusing personally.
I thought the same thing of 抱くようにして
Also looking for 肩を抱く on google images confirms this.
I agree with the interpretation of the dialect: 珍しいこともある.
珍しいこども(missing particle)ある doesn’t make much sense in my opinion.
For the もの, this is not actually referring to a thing or object, but it’s just a sort of sentence ender, like もんね, or ものだ(ね), used for emphasis or indicating surprise.
The usage of も might also relate to the nuance of surprise, I think? Like, these sorts of things happen too, huh? Probably because they rarely get children asking for directions.
Attempting a translation, I would probably write “Sometimes unusual things happen (too), huh?” It’s a bit simple maybe, but I find it really hard to translate such sentences naturally.
I’ll put in another vote for 珍しいこと. Considering the rest of the sentence (which I don’t think anyone posted) I think this makes more sense.
You have been busy while I was asleep… Just to confirm my instructor described the action just as @NicoleIsEnough has explained… So a gold star for you
goo’s entry has six subdefinitions in the first main definition, plus two other top-level definitions with two subdefinitions each. Don’t have time to parse out how many meanings they’re actually distinguishing, but I think half of them are old Japanese things, at a glance. I’d love to compare my Sanseido kids’ dictionary, but I’m not going to have it with me for a while.
But, I would also note that goo’s entry for 上げる has 14 definitions. That doesn’t necessarily mean that anyone in Japan thinks there are 14 different 上げるs.
wow…so much discussion… I only had time to respond to @NicholeRauch about the one thing on the phone this morning…I think what was found the grammar dictionary is correct that it’s not a direct object particle but the particle which indicates a space in…
have to admit, honestly I didn’t even notice this when I read through as an intransitive verb just thought eh…I’m less worried about why a the particle is a particle if it doesn’t look out of place … now I’m thinking I need to pay more attention…
One thing from ichimoe that backups what’s in the grammar dictionary is:
Page 10
女の人まで、心配そうについてきた。
From the context I assume the woman is the one following along.
I’m confused by まで though. We have “seeming worried, she followed along”. But then why まで? All I could think was that it meant "seeming as concerned as the woman, but then who can it be referring to?
Meaning 3 on jisho: „to (an extent); up to; so far as; even“
女の人まで、(心配そうに)ついてきた。
Even the woman came along, (looking concerned).
Sometimes I want to cry.
I get the right definition and everything, and then I fail to notice the one little word at the end. Which honestly doesn’t even seem interchangeable with the others.
Thanks for your help
Reading from an e-book, so no pages from me. This is like the 4th sentence, though:
きいだごどねえなあ=聞いたこと(は)ないなあ?
Found it in the sheet. God damn it, it’s ga, not wa.
Edit: 見でわがるえ what’s the え doing?
E2: だおの=です?