For a long time I simple refered to Urushi as センパイ.
Her name does not pop up often.
For a long time I simple refered to Urushi as センパイ.
My thoughts on this week’s reading:
I’ve been able to read hiragana and katakana since 1995. And yet when I see a simple panel like this, sometimes it just feels amazing that I can see this panel and read what’s on it and just understand it all.
Yeah, it’s a very low bar. I’ve been reading for a few years now, so there’s a lot here I can read and understand without look-ups. But there’s just something about enjoying the simple things.
I love Urushi’s disheveled hair as she’s flummoxed here.
I mentioned this earlier, but I really really really like the whole speech/thought juxtaposition. Somehow it makes the character (Ayumu in this case) feel a bit more “real” to me. (And he needs all the realness he can get, since he typically only ever has one expression…)
It’s easy for her to look so innocent when she has no idea what she just detailed at the absolute last moment.
I’m not much of a Maki fan (nothing personal), but I do like how she brings herself down to Urushi’s eye level here.
I’ve noticed anime/manga do this thing with character’s eyes when they are supposed to be somewhat “vapid,” but it gives me the chills a little bit… She seems like a nice enough character (bringing herself down to Urushi’s level indicates some kindness, at least), and maybe more exposure to her will change my opinion, but for right now, her eyes just creep me out a bit. It doesn’t give a “vapid” impression to me, so much as “demonically possessed.”
That is to say, I am also not currently a Maki fan. Lol.
I actually forgot to ask about this, and you mentioning it reminded me that this confused me too! Thanks for that. I had also forgotten that was her last name. I should try to remember when I can’t find the definition of a word, to think about whether it could be a name.
Not sure about the eye thing though haha. They look normal to me.
To me she just looks a bit like someone who is up to mischief. Like trying to help Urushi and Ayumu to get closer in her own (a little bit weird and teasing) way. She also sort of reminds me of Takagi from the Takagi-san manga. (just in teasing type of personality)
Also her hair looks sort of fluffy, which makes me think that she is the beautiful and popular type of character, but not sure here.
Oh yeah, she is definitely supposed to be the “popular, beautiful” trope. I just pick up “vapid/shallow” vibes from her as well. The other example that immediately comes to mind for the eye thing (there are more, but this was the first one to come to mind by virtue of recency) would be the character Yoshi from Ijiranaide Nagatoro-san, who is definitely quite shallow:
It’s the extra-colored-in eyes that I tend to find off-putting (just a personal thing, though!). The “demonically-possessed” descriptor just comes about thanks to a number of shows choosing for “possessed/evil” eyes to be filled in as all-black with a small white pupil, so that’s what my brain jumps to first.
I’m trying to transition into a bit more intensive of a reading so I’m trying to analize things that I did not understand so far but sort of assumed from context. Wish me luck!
On that matter, I’ll write down some questions i have of this week’s reading as I come along (only chapter 19, since I read 18 before coming to this resolution haha):
I’m not quite sure I get the のは use at the end of the sentence. I can guess that the の is nominalizing the statement and the は is the topic marker, but I’m not sure what their function as a whole is
I think I understand this statement as sort of an “I got this!” moment, but I think it’s funny how ある can mean this not literal sense of “having” as well. Is this usually the way one would say something like this? I don’t recall seeing it before.
I have seen もんな around but I never really get it, is it a contraction of もの + な? If so is it something like “The case is…”, in this case being something like " Maki is a beauty so of course (he talks to her instead of me)"?
And that’s all for this week, I’m going to try to continue this trend of trying to ask the correct questions to improve my immersion and make it a bit more intensive, thanks for the club as always!
Oh, I do get what you mean but from that context I get more of a Sakura vibes (had to look up her name, pic attached)
Maki gives me less selfish vibes but a lot of that あら~ あら~ personality, I haven’t read anymore yet so I guess we will later see whose read was more accurate haha
Sakura is definitely an apt comparison, personality-wise. I also don’t know that I view Maki as selfish/self-centered. When I use the term vapid/shallow, I’m not meaning in the sense of self-obsessed or anything like that. I’m just trying to politely say she doesn’t strike me as all that smart, I guess, and the overly-colored in eyes/flat colored eyes is something I’ve seen in previous characters in anime and manga who were, well, dumb. (Also a yandere-mode trait, to further justify my sense of disquiet about it )
Though, she did cotton on to the fact that they like each other, so she at least has that kind of sense about her. It really is just a surface evaluation. I’m hoping to come around to the character as we see more of her!
Edit: wiped that first explanation because I fell into my bad habit of needlessly separating speech bubbles!
This is one whole phrase:
Which would read as:
(As for) obstacle course races, (I) have belief in myself/self confidence!
The I is implied by virtue of the fact that it’s “self” confidence.
Either way, it being a literal having of something still applies, and is not necessarily what I would call an abstract use.
I read this exactly as you did. It is a contraction もの+な. もの is used as a “reason is/because” explanatory ending; it can also imply a sense of dissatisfaction (“It can’t be helped” sorta vibes to it), which I think fits the panel well.
I’ll leave Pg. 41 to someone else who can explain it better… のは is something that I “get” on an instinctual level but haven’t been able to satisfactorily put it into words even for myself (my notes on it are just several pages of rambling and explicating that even I find useless, so).
Ahh yeah, I do understand what you meant, but I also feel like she does have more in her head, like in that situation. She might not be traditionally smart but she does seem emotionally smart at least to some extent.
Conversely, Gamo is mostly an airhead that basically just follows the other two around haha, while Maki gives me more of an airhead leader vibe perhaps .
Ohhh, yeah, i completely misread that, it was less abstract than I thought, putting the two bubbles together does make it make more sense for some reason haha, thankss!
Ohh thanks for the link, that helped clear things up, i didn’t know of this sentence ender form of もん/もの. Seems like those bits of grammar that you can sorta work out by context even without knowing them tho, which is nice, now to add it to my toolbox somehow haha. Thanks!
Yeah, のは is just weird, I think it’s one of those things that you just understand instinctively and accept it as it is
This is a good spot to reassess how は is used, and what it means.
You can boil down a Japanese sentence to two parts: the topic, and a comment on that topic. (The topic can be left unspoken if it’s clear from context.)
A topic must be a noun, or a noun phrase. A noun phrase is essentially a clause (sentence) that has の at the end to turn it into a noun. (Words such as もの or こと can be used in place of の in various cases.)
On the panel in question, Urushi’s whole sentence is being turned into a topic:
「わが将棋部員を勧誘する」 as a noun phrase essentially translates as “recruiting members of my shogi club”. This is the topic that she’s commenting on. But the comment isn’t included in this panel. So where is the comment?
Typically a comment comes after the topic. In some cases, a person makes a comment, then they state the topic after to clarify what they are commenting on. (I suppose you can also give a topic by itself if it’s clear from context what your comment is. I’ve never taken notice of if this happens. Something for me to look out for?)
In this case, her comment is from the prior panel:
“Hey, can you stop it?” (Very loose translation.)
In this comment, it’s clear that Urushi is telling her classmates to stop doing something, but it may not be clear what exactly they’re doing that she wants them to stop. Thus she follows up by giving the topic that she was commenting on.
Topic then comment: “On the topic of recruiting my shogi club member, can you please stop it?”
Comment, then topic: “Hey, can you stop it? Recruiting my shogi cub member.”
This has already been covered, but I wanted to mention the topic-comment angle.
She’s saying the comment “confidence exists” about the topic “at obstacle courses”.
Topic then comment: “Regarding obstacle courses, there is confidence!”
Saying “confidence exists” sounds odd to a native English speaker (and likely native speakers of other Western languages), because in English we like to have a person or thing as the subject. We wouldn’t say “Confidence exists in my ability to read this manga,” we’d say “I have confidence in my ability to read this manga.”
This is one of those areas where once you start specifically paying attention to it, it becomes more clear how often this happens in Japanese, and how it differs from English.
This もん (もの) sentence ending seems to come up a lot in this author’s writing. I actually didn’t start to get to know it until I started reading the Takagi-san manga in the ABBC. But once you’ve become familiar with its existence, it’s surprising just how much it comes up. I remember listening to the Studio Ghibli movie My Neighbor Totoro after learning about this ending a sentence with もん, and I was amazed to find that Mei ends her sentences this way all the time. I hadn’t even noticed it before.
Oh my god that makes so much sense and still somehow is so weird to conceptualize haha.
I think I get the gist of it, the structure is basically divided in both panels but it’s backwards of what I expect.
However, it clearly makes sense in the context of spoken language, since urushi is trying to be smug and accentuate the “stop” part. I’m imagining something of the sort of “Stop!” “That’s my club member you’re trying to recruit!”.
Thank you so much, I will try to look at future は enders with these lenses from now on.
Ohh yeah, it comes to the less ego centered nature of japanese I guess, ある is actually to exist but it just can’t be translated that way and we have to go to more natural english phrases like “having confidence”.
Yeah, I sort of ignored it’s existence so far but I can’t ignore it no more!
So many もん's... (other manga by this mangaka)
But at least 20 leads right into 21 =D
Hello offshoot thread - a courtesy note that volumes 1 and 2 of this series are currently free-to-keep on Bookwalker for any late starters (links can be found here).
I finished chapter 20 today (actually I decided to read it a second time today). Overall I think it was quite easy to understand, but I have two questions:
I understand that this sentence means something like “us from group 2 will win.”
But I’m wondering a bit about the とらせてもらう construct.
I think もらう means something like “receive” so is this more like “We will receive the win from you.”?
Honestly I don’t really understand the meaning of 行き会った here.
When I look it up on jisho it says: “to meet somebody by chance; to happen upon”
which doesn’t seem correct.
Does it perhaps mean something like “In the second half we were relatively matched up.” like in sync while walking? But completely guessing here.
I’ve put way too much time over the months trying to come to understand the causitive + もらう. (This came up in chapter one, and I’m still not really certain for sure its meaning there!)
We can see on HiNative someone asking the meaning of this construct. A native Japanese speaker responds:
Here’s my attempt at an English translation:
This may not answer your question, but I’m still working on grasping this myself. I think I need to see it in a lot of different contexts to really get a feel for it.
Both here and in chapter one, it’s used in the context of competition.
In chapter one, Ayumu (who always loses to Urushi) was looking to win their shogi match.
I wonder if perhaps Ayumu’s friend normally loses in competition to Ayumu, but he expects to win this time (because, as per the third panel, Ayumu remarks on how good his friends are at this event).
One day I hope to magically understand this grammar!
Page 57: You have a typo
We have run into this causative form + もらう a time or two before in this manga. The earliest example all the way back in chapter 1. Here is my post, with a link talking about させてもらう included, from that discussion thread:
Editing to add the link I referenced since the post doesn’t show up as a dropdown like it usually would: させてもらう | WordReference Forums
The gist of it is that させて+もらう, while a permission-requesting statement, can also carry heavy vibes of, “This will happen.”
Basically saying, “Hey, is it okay if I do this?” while already doing it, so to speak.
In this case:
取る becomes とらせて and もらう is added on.
とる means “to take,” but can have a meaning of “to win.”
In this instance, I would read the sentence as:
“Sorry, but we of group 2 will take (with the take meaning “win”) this relay!”
悪いが = Sorry, but
このリレー = this relay
2組のオレたちが = we of group 2 with topic particle
とらせてもらう = “will take,” is the cleanest English translation, but would really be “will have you let us take,” which is unwieldy and awkward, but preserves the “permission” aspect of it.
Though again, it isn’t actually asking permission. It’s a reflexive politeness thing masking a “this is happening” feeling. It’s really weird, for sure, but the mangaka really enjoys this construct, it would seem.
I just finished up with Chapter 21, and I’m left with one thing I’m not 100% sure on.
When Urushi says:
I think it breaks down like this:
んな = Short for そんな
ベタ = meaning cliched
So I took that to mean something along the lines of:
“Something like that is cliché.”
Did I interpret that correctly?
Story Comments/Standout Panels
Both of the chapters were cute, as usual, though I think I enjoyed Chapter 21 the best out of the two of them.
With that said, I did enjoy this panel from Chapter 20 a lot. The artwork was cute, and the sentiment was really sweet. I do have to admit that it took me reading through it several times to get the meaning, though. This was a pretty long sentence, and it being broken up between two speech bubbles did me no favors (my brain over-compartmentalizes the bubbles), either. It was really satisfying to be able to read that without having to look up any vocab or grammar, however. It was just a matter of keeping the whole sentence strung together in my mind as it went along since it was so much information all at once.
This facial expression after Maki’s teasing, and the realization that Ayumu was coming straight for her gave me a good laugh. This chapter did warm me up to Maki a little bit, even if her eyes are slightly off-putting for me, still. She does seem like she will, at least, be an entertaining character.
Creepy eyes aside, I really enjoyed these two expressions side-by-side. Urushi doesn’t know what to do with herself, while Maki is so ecstatic that I couldn’t help but laugh.
It’s the eyes, man.
I am really glad we saw the 物 kanji just a panel before, because that stylistic choice of font would have been impossible for me to read without the aid of the furigana and knowing what is said in advance. That said, poor girl. I don’t think anybody ever wants to be referred to as an object, lovely or otherwise.
You’ve got it right.
Related videos for research:
- 【漫画】読者モデルの彼氏自慢してた真似女が私の初めての彼氏を馬鹿にしてくる。、体育祭の借り物競争でとんでもない結果に 【スカッとする話】 - YouTube (about 5 1/2 minutess in)
- 【胸キュン】野球部エースのイケメン男子が選んだ女の子とは？運動会の借り物競争で公開告白 - YouTube (about 6 minutes in)
Ah right it’s actually:
but the word still stays as 行き会うwhich translates as “to meet somebody by chance; to happen upon”? Or is there still another typo?
I think this was the best one