Week 2 葬送のフリーレン ・Frieren 🧝‍♂️ (Beginner Book Club)

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Welcome to Week 2 of 葬送のフリーレン ・Frieren

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Week 2 26 April 2024
Start Page 16
End Page 29
Chapters Chapter 1 Part 2/3
Last week Week 1
Next week Week 3
Home Thread Here

Page numbers are the ones printed on the bottom of the pages. These may differ from the numbering in digital versions.

Last panel iamge

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Vocabulary

Vocabulary spreadsheet

Characters
Many characters have katakana names that derive from German words.

Japanese German English
フリーレン Frieren Freeze
ヒンメル Himmel Sky or heaven
アイゼン Eisen Iron
ハイター Heiter Cheerful

Discussion Guidelines

Spoiler Courtesy

Please follow these rules to avoid inadvertent ネタバレ. If you’re unsure whether something should have a spoiler tag, err on the side of using one.

  1. Any potential spoiler for the current week’s reading need only be covered by a spoiler tag. Predictions and conjecture made by somebody who has not read ahead still falls into this category.
  2. Any potential spoilers for external sources need to be covered by a spoiler tag and include a label (outside of the spoiler tag) of what might be spoiled. These include but are not limited to: other book club picks, other books, games, movies, anime, etc. I recommend also tagging the severity of the spoiler (for example, I may still look at minor spoilers for something that I don’t intend to read soon).
  3. Any information from later in the book than the current week’s reading (including trigger warnings that haven’t yet manifested) needs to be hidden by spoiler tags and labeled as coming from later sections.
Instructions for Spoiler Tags

Click the cog above the text box and use either the “Hide Details” or “Blur Spoiler” options. The text which says “This text will be hidden” should be replaced with what you are wishing to write. In the case of “Hide Details”, the section in the brackets that is labelled “Summary” can be replaced with whatever you like also (i.e, [details=”Chapter 1, Pg. 1”]).

Hide Details results in the dropdown box like below:

Example

This is an example of the “Hide Details” option.

The “Blur Spoiler” option will simply blur the text it surrounds.

This is an example of the “Blur Spoiler” option.

Posting Advice
  • When asking for help, please mention the page number, and check before posting that your question hasn’t already been asked. As the threads get longer, it becomes more convenient to use the Search function, which is located in the upper right corner of the forum. It is the magnifying glass which is near your profile picture! The best way to search is usually to type part of the sentence you are confused about, and select “in this topic”. This will show you all posts within the current thread which has that string of text.
  • Be sure to join the conversation! It’s fun, and it’s what keeps these book clubs lively! There’s no such thing as a stupid question! We are all learning here, and if the question has crossed your mind, there’s a very good chance it has crossed somebody else’s also! Asking and answering questions is a great learning opportunity for everyone involved, so never hesitate to do so!

Participation

Will you be reading along with us this week?
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  • I’ve already read previously but I’m here for the discussion
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0 voters
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Writing for Love and Justice — FRIEREN: BEYOND JOURNEY'S END — episode 1

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LOL

Frieren

And another story spoiler comment, page 20:

I was really surprised that this fellow was Himmel. I had to read on for a couple of pages to verify. People don’t shrink that much when they get old, do they? I’ll chalk it up to artistic liberty, but it was very confusing for a moment. :slight_smile:

I transcribed the handwritten text, for those who are interested. The kanji were already in the vocab sheet, but here’s the full text. They weren’t too bad, the handwriting is better than in some other manga I read.

Handwritten text p.18

召喚に使うのに…

なんか邪悪なオーラ
みたいなの出てるけど
人体に害はないよね？

わかんないかぁ…
わかんない

Handwritten text p.25

さすがドワーフ

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I read to page 19 today!

Story Plot Stuff

Just looking at how much older Monacle is on page 18 compared to page 16, even before the end of that page and her thinking about the meteor shower it’s so obvious that so much time has passed.

Then the last speech bubble on page 19? That’s going to be one of her companions, and they’re going to be old while she looks exactly the same, and I really want to turn the page and see who it is but also I need to not I need to pace myself but dear heck I can already tell this is going to be a lot of emotions. :sob:

Also, she got tricked by a mimic again! Oh dear XD

Page 16

Top left panel, struggling a bit with the string of kana. I broke it up like 「５０年も１００年も・彼女にとっては・些細なもの・なの・かもしれないね。」and got “Perhaps 50 years or 100 years are, as far as she is concerned, a trivial thing, right?” but can’t figure out what that なの in the middle is for.

Page 18

Middle left panel, I’m a little confused why 「困ったな」 is in past tense here when it seems like Frieren is currently feeling that? Also the 「召喚に使うのに…」I think is roughly “In order to summon it…” but that bit is so short I’m sure there’s context bits that change how that is.

Bottom right panel, the part that Himmel is saying in the handwriting, I think that’s along the lines of “It looks like something with a wicked aura coming out of it, but it’s not harming the human body, isn’t that right?” which, besides being clunky, is that the right kind of nuance? Maybe a more natural sounding way of phrasing that would be like “It looks evil, but it doesn’t seem to be harmful, is it?”

Bottom left panel 「 もうすぐ半世紀流星の時期だし、 ついでに取りに行くか」I’m confused in the grammar in the second half. Based on the context of the first half I think it’s like “Since it’s almost time for that half-century meteor, while I’m at it, should I go to take them?” But just looking at how bad the grammar is in my English version I know that’s not going to be it :sweat_smile:

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Mimic count: 2

Thank you for the transcription. I was just staring at 害 in despair when you posted.

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Page 18

Middle left panel, I’m a little confused why 「困ったな」 is in past tense here when it seems like Frieren is currently feeling that?

You see that with 困る a lot. I think of it as “It’s become a problem” (implied: and is still is), but it’s also one of those things that’s not worth overthinking.

Also the 「召喚に使うのに…」I think is roughly [spoiler]“In order to summon it…”

のに literally means “even though”, but it’s one of those nuance things where it sometimes sounds more natural not to translate it at all. So Frieren probably means something like “(But) I need it for a summoning” (more literally: “But you use it for summonings” or something).

Bottom right panel, the part that Himmel is saying in the handwriting, I think that’s along the lines of “It looks like something with a wicked aura coming out of it, but it’s not harming the human body, isn’t that right?” which, besides being clunky, is that the right kind of nuance? Maybe a more natural sounding way of phrasing that would be like [spoiler]“It looks evil, but it doesn’t seem to be harmful, is it?”

If I were a professional translator, I’d maybe make it sound less like a rhetorical question and more like something that requires an actual answer, since Frieren answers “I don’t know”, but I think you got the gist very well.

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p16

My understanding is that this is a form of the のです grammar pattern.

First of all, the な is only there because of the embedded sentence
些細なものだ turns into 些細なものなの
If this was a sentence saying “些細なものなのです”, it would be an explanatory sentece saying “It’s because this is trivial for her”. But changing it to “些細なものなのかもしれないね”, it’s “Maybe it’s because it’s a trivial thing for her”

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のに has a second meaning: in order to. I think that might be the meaning for this case.
See のに (JLPT N3) | Bunpro

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Page 18

Hm, might be true. However, isn’t it kind of redundant here, because the first に already marks 召喚 as the purpose for which you’d need the horn?

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Page 24

image

Was exactly is Himmel’s answer here? Frieren seems to be saying something like “There’s no point in obsessing because you’re bald”. And then he’s like “I have an obsession with getting bald”. Is this just the equivalent of a petulant “yes, there is”, or is he worried about getting even balder or is there some completely different nuance that I’m missing?

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p. 18

In that usage it’d refer to the whole verb phrase including 使う - so “in order to use it for summoning”. I agree that that’s probably not it, though. It doesn’t make much sense here.

のに can be used at the end of a sentence similarly to けど and the like, but with more of a nuance of being frustrated or complaining. So I would translate this as “I need to for a summoning, though…”

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p. 24

Frieren is saying there’s nothing to fuss over because he’s bald. Himmel is saying his baldness is exactly what he’s fussing over.

It’s a slight difference in meaning - once again illustrating how Frieren comes across as overly practical and cold. Frieren’s only concerned with the practicality of there being no hair to do anything with. Himmel on the other hand is lamenting getting old (and getting bald as a result).

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なりに is a grammar point which can be translated as “in one’s own way or style”.

Example:

彼は足が遅いが、遅いなりに全力で走った。
(He may be slow, but he ran with all his might.)

I agree with you and in addition I’d say the grammar なりに gives a nuance of Himmel saying “bald people have their share of things to worry/be picky about”.

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p.18 and 24

Thought so. That’s what I was trying to express in my own translation attempt with the “but”.
Thanks to you and @Redglare for the explanations regarding page 24.

Oof, when I asked this question, I didn’t expect an N1 grammar point. It looks so innocent, like just another nounification or something.

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pg. 18

A little stumped on this one:

適当に納屋にでも放り込んでおいてくれてよかったのに。

適当に納屋にでも – appropriately, (OR carelessly?) into a shed or something
放り込んでおいてくれてよかったのに to be tossed (seems to have a negative connotation) + in advance + for me + I’m glad that (even though…)

Is is something like:
Frieren: I’m glad you carelessly tossed it into a shed or something (in advance, maybe for me to later retrieve it) for me This would be… sarcastic? ???
And then the response would be, from Himmel:
“そう​‌は​いかない”! not a chance / I would never! (I guessed this because on the next page he says something to the effect of, for you, this is casual, but I took holding this thing for you seriously)

Idk! Input appreciated. Thanks folks. P.S. I freaking love this manga already. I didn’t know anything about it prior.

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p. 18

The でも is in the sense of “… or something”

The ～てよかった is a bit different from the standard textbook grammar point, this sentence is more of a hypothetical, and よかった is just the past tense of いい. So it’s just 納屋にでも放り込んでおいてくれていい but in past tense, rather than a distinct grammar point. She’s saying something to the effect of “it would have been fine to just throw it in a shed or something”.

Also note that ～ておく is not just for doing things in advance, but more generally for doing something and then leaving it like that. The implication here being throwing the thing into a shed and just not paying any attention to it after.

Yup, once again a mismatch in emotional value. From Frieren’s point of view, he was holding onto this thing for her for just a little while - it would have been a pain to drag it around while doing other stuff, and it’s only for a few decades anyway, barely any time at all. From Himmel’s point of view, it was a precious memento from an important person, and he had it for most of his life.

This sort of mismatch is going to be very common with Frieren.

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Thanks for the detailed explanations, @yamitenshi ! I’m learning so much already. :blush:

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Listen, that censorship fuzz is implying… weird things. And is there even anything there that needs censoring? :stuck_out_tongue:

It’s definitely not the last time this will happen. :stuck_out_tongue:

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pg. 27

懐かしいよ。こうしているとあのときに戻ったかのようだ。
What is the significance / nuance of ending the verb with か here? I understand よう draws a likeness to something else, this case being, I think, “it’s like we’ve returned to those days (of adventuring)”. But does what’s the difference with and without the か?

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p. 27

～かのようだ is similar to ～ようだ, but seems to carry a bit of a different connotation as far as I can tell. It seems to me like just using ～ようだ is more about expressing what something looks like, seems like, etc. whereas ～かのようだ expresses a bit more uncertainty in a way - you’re not necessarily saying you think the preceding phrase is actually the case, it just a comparison you’re making. So the way I interpret the difference is I could say ゆうれい見たようだ, which implies “based on what I’m seeing, I’d say you actually saw a ghost”, or I could say ゆうれい見たかのようだ, which is more of “you probably didn’t actually see a ghost, but your face/behavior/… suggests you might as well have”.

In this particular case, the feeling I get is that あのときに戻ったようだ would be more like expressing factually it’s just like back when they were adventuring, whereas あのときに戻ったかのようか has more of a sense of reminiscence, and feeling as if he’s actually returned back to his adventuring days, even though he clearly hasn’t. It’s what carries the connotation of “this sure takes me back”, in a way.

At least, that’s how I interpret it, but I’ll admit I learned about this particular bit of grammar very recently, when I read that phrase :smile:

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