Hi! I wanted to ask: what’s the best step-by-step way to learn Japanese?

Japanese Language
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I’ve been trying to learn Japanese for about two years but I’ve been very on and off. Every time I come back I always return to the basics like hiragana katakana and simple phrases. Then I stop again forget everything and restart from the beginning.

I think my main problem is that I don’t have a solid foundation. My study methods keep changing and I feel like I don’t have any clear structure. That’s why I was planning to buy Japanese From Zero but I saw that many people here say it’s not that good.

So I want to ask if there is something similar to Japanese From Zero that covers everything from the beginning in one clear and consistent path. Something that won’t make me jump between different resources or create my own steps.

And if there isn’t a single book that covers everything could you recommend a step by step learning plan that actually works. Most advice I see online like on TikTok or Google is always the same. Learn hiragana then katakana which I’ve already done for years. After that they just say use this app or use that app but those apps don’t give a real foundation and everything feels scattered.

Basically I want a method that is structured consistent and beginner friendly so I can finally stop restarting every time I study.

If you recommend apps can you also explain what each one is good for. For example I used YouSpeak and even though it says it’s for beginners it’s not really for complete beginners. A lot of the content feels more like middle level because you’re already expected to speak in Japanese. So I want to know what level each app is actually helpful for.

Tyy

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I don’t know about japanese from zero but there are a lot of recommended text books out there

genki
minna no nihongo
tobira

are the ones most often cited

there’s also tae kim online and I know a lot of people swear by a dictionary of japanese grammar but I don’t think that is as ‘step-by-step’ as you want

Personally, I’d grab one of the text books that you like the look of (maybe sail the seas first before you actually purchase one to make sure it suits you), get working through some of the early grammar, start SRS vocab, either the core decks or ones specific to the text book you are using (each lesson will normally introduce a list of new words that will be used in the chapter) and then once you have a base of grammar sorted, i’d start using something to learn kanji

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I’ve used / am using Japanese from Zero and Genki. I like both of them. I wouldn’t recommend using just one textbook.

When you start learning Grammar and doing all the exercises use Hiragana and Katakana. And don’t be discouraged If remembering Katakana Takes longer than Hiragana. That’s normal. There are a lot of very similar Katakana and it’s Not used as often as Hiragana.

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Hello, I’m not a very experimented learner but I thought I could help you with your problem since I had exactly the same…

First you have to trust your own pace, if you don’t know where to start it’s completely normal and personally I took all my N5 to find a routine adapted for me (≈5month) so the best advice I can give is to try as many apps or learning techniques as you can because their is not an universal way to learn and you have to find the learning method you like to build an habbit and then you will learn enficiently.

If you want app recommendation I would say bunpro for the grammar and vocab (it’s the same system of SRS review and you can pair wanikani to bunpro easily). Wanikani for kanji and doing what you like to remember and practice (personally writing and reading), I also use ringotan to learn how to draw and to help me memorizing and duolingo (:warning:for me duolingo is one of the worst app to learn a language but the gamification system is a good way to enjoy learning but I advice you to not use it as “the thing that will make you fluent”. And finally a lot of immersion : listening japanese music and pause each time you don’t understand (yes it can be hard at the start :sweat_smile:), watching japanese show without subtitles, reading, language exchange, teaching…

So now I told you what I used to learn every day for 6 months so far the last thing I want to say is take your time, try a lot of method and enjoy learning :grin:.

(I’m not sure if all the text is corect I’m not fluent in english yet but I hope you understand)

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Hi! I wrote my level 60 celebration post trying to answer this very question :slight_smile: maybe it can be useful to you:

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Hi! I just want to ask what is the best order to learn Japanese. I see many different opinions. Some people say to learn vocabulary first then study grammar later while others say to focus on grammar first before memorizing words. Some also say to learn kanji early and others say to learn it after grammar. So I want to know what is the proper sequence that a beginner should follow and where I should start first.

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hiragana
katakana
very basic grammar (は、です）
then everything everywhere all at once

after a certain point you can’t not learn everything together in a big mush because it’s ridiculous to learn more advanced grammar when you can’t read some of the basic kanji, since none of the stuff you are looking at beyond very extremely focused beginner material is going to not use kanji

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This is really helpful thank you so much. Now I feel more motivated and I feel like I can really do this. I already have some base and background in Japanese which makes things easier for me because my native language is close to Japanese pronunciation. I also know a few words so this information is very helpful and motivating for me.

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みんなの日本語 is probably the best beginner textbook I used in terms of being straightforward and clear, but it presents a challenge at first. Still, it’s really good, and if you know ひらがな and カタカナ already, then it should provide some good, steady practice.

Japanase for Busy People was a great starter textbook for me, but I started in my late 30s and am not sure how old you are.

Genki has some good points, and I think the latest edition might have cleared up the issues with the earlier layout and presentation. My favorite thing about it is the Dialogues and some of the reading material in the Appendixes.

*****

Once you reach the N4 level, however, I’m not sure if there’s a clear cut recommended way to move through the intermediate phases, which is where I’ve been floating and navigating. I’ve found that my motivation fluctuates for using various resources and while I still engage in Japanese every day, my desire to crack on with a particular resource can often vary.

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Hi :grin:, for me in learning a language their is not an order but sure in japanese you must learn hiragana and katagana first (since you’ve already done that it’s not a problem) then I advise you to learn all at once but make sure to be at the same level for every skills you train. Personally I learn grammar, vocabulary and kanji at the N4 level and the best thing I found to be precise on my way to pass N4 is to make a percentage.

Let me explain : I guess you’re in the N5 level so if I was you I would learn 14 vocabulary word and 2 grammar point/day and the wanikani max lessons each day so you’re basically going the same speed at every skill since in N5 you have to learn ≈1100 vocabulary word, ≈127 grammar point and ≈79 kanji. So that was my advice but if you want to make your own things to review it’s just about doing math to calculate the % of things you have done on what you have to do. For calculating the kanji part I recomend using “wk stats” and after entering your API on the app you can go to “charts–>jlpt” and you have you’re % based on your wanikani level.

For the more “abstract” things like reading, traduction, shadowing I didn’t found a clear progression yet so I just do it on the side.

And finally to last step is to determine your level by passing a JLPT test (I strongly recomend the free jlpt test on bunpro that’s actually the same as the real test exept the listening part).

I told you everything I know on learning japanese but I’m not sure it’ll fit to you because everyone is different. I made a lot reference to jlpt because it’s for me a great way to evaluate your progression and remember to find your own routine with what you like :wink:.

I hope it help, take care :+1:

Edit : and don’t forget to make more production than absorption (idk if it’s clear I just read that somewhere but the main part is to produce like sentences, talking, shadowing, writing with the vocabulary and grammar you’ve learnt). And don’t take my advice very seriously since I’m not at a very high level in japanese, I want to share what works for me not dictate anyone on what to do or whatever :joy:.

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@Rin_tsuhi

Have you considered/looked at MaruMori ? Has a dedicated app.

Has a 14 day trial so you can try before you buy. It’s expensive (for lifetime subscription) but I’ve seen enough videos to convince me to sign up.

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The reason you’ll see different advice is because there are many ways to learn.

But it does all come down to:
Step 1:

Learn hiragana (and katakana)

Step 2: (This is a forever step by the way)

  • Learn kanji, grammar, and vocab (yes, concurrently, so you see actual sentences).

How one goes about doing that varies a lot. There are textbooks like Genki, but as with all textbooks they can’t cover everything in one book so you’ll have to get either the next one in the series, or another series as you become more advanced. For example, people who use Genki often “graduate” to Quartet when they’re done.

Some people use apps, where they prefer a subscription (or lifetime if available) to do that.

MaruMori is definitely a good option, offers everything in one place (kanji, vocab, grammar) and is currently up to N2-level content.

Some people do one app for each aspect, rather than an all-in one. So someone might do:

  • Kanji - WK
  • Grammar - Bunpro
  • Vocab - Anki

(and many, many other variations).

For example I do:

  • NativShark for grammar, vocab, and sentence-form listening.
  • MaruMori for grammar (yes, two grammar courses, my brain needs variety to learn), kanji, and vocab
  • JapanesePod101 for dialogue-form listening
  • And I was doing WK for Kanji up until level 36, but stopping for a bit to focus on MM. Might pick WK up again for double kanji resource because once again my brain likes multi-resource learning, but I can’t handle the workload right now.

Step 3: Graded Content and Immersion

Using your skills in practice. Different people start this at different times, but generally for people who don’t like things to be too hard, it goes:

  • If you’re going to do graded readers, you can start when you feel like you’ve gotten a good amount of N5 grammar down ok.
  • If you’re going to read native content, if it’s (8-11 year old) kids content you can start at around mid-N4. If reading content for young adults (or just non-difficult adult content), then N3 is often a better starting point.

The most important aspect to learning though…
Is to not quit. Always keep going. You’ll revise what tools you need over time, and maybe you’ll think some of them weren’t useful (the reason so many resources exist is that different people have different needs, and those needs can even vary for the same person over time). But that’s ok. An inefficient study material is still better than stopping. You’ll figure it out as long as you keep going.

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If you can afford to spend a bit, maybe go on iTalki and look for a teacher. They can help give you a solid structure and keep you in a routine. Otherwise any standard textbook should do the trick.

There’s no one single way - language is more complex than that, and everybody has different goals. Like is your goal to read, speak, write? All three? My goal was reading (and to an extent listening), when I started. So resources for writing kanji or for conversation weren’t as relevant for me. May be different for you or anyone else tho.

As this sort of app goes, I found LingoDeer to be much, much better. I think it can be used from pretty early on, but it’s been a long time since I was there

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I started out with RocketLaguages.com. It has everything you need up to at least N3. It has conversations with explanations of vocabulary and grammar, culture, grammar, and plenty of reinforcement. You can go at your own pace and can review whenever you want. There are also quizzes on each lesson. I love this site, and there is a sale around Christmas. You can try three free lessons now if you want to see how you like it.

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I was on Rocket today and they have updated and added 30 more lessons onto the Level 3 module. It’s really nice and has lots of new stuff on it. I love the improvements!

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Who says JFZ is not good? Everyone has an opinion and It is my opinion that its one of the best books on the market. I bought all five books and made it to the 5th book(I’m on the first chapter) and each one is gold. Proof that it all works is that I can read Toshukan graded readers at level 3. Everyone has their opinion, so mine is that JFZ grammar explanations are stupid simple, and it has vocab and even kanji starting from the 3rd book. Then they have hours of vocab and grammar explanations for free on youtube. I simply cant with books that use technical grammar definion terms when grammar should be straightforward. In your native language you aren’t using grammar descriptive terminology so why should you use it for language learning?

I love the pacing in how its slow enough for the concepts to stick and trust me by the 3rd book it speeds up quickly. The first is hiragana basics and it intentionally slow. The second is Katakana. I like how it has an approachable informal style presentation which is desperately needed for a hard language like Japanese. It feels less like a textbook and more like a set of curated notes on the language.

Proof that they are good enough is that very soon, by May(hopefully) I will be doing tobira. People get so stressed out about trying to optimize their learning path that they get choice paralysis. Just pick up any of the commonly suggested books (JFZ book1, Genki 1, the others ) and if you don’t like one try another.

My suggestion, and of course everyone has their opinion just do all the JFZ books, follow the youtube video playlists and do your best. Of course this doesn’t guarantee you will make it, because it has been quite a fight so far because no matter what tool or method you still have to have it in you to show up every day and grind.

Now to be fair, I haven’t looked at other books but I certainly don’t regret my choice of textbook and so it feels very unfair that people are so dismissive of the books when they are perfectly serviceable, insightful, genuinely fun, and many have gotten their start from them. In fact my current plan is to prioritize WK and in parllel do JFZ5 and then later Tobira when there is room available and that will be it for textbooks.

Finally, there is no one best way. There is only the way that works for you. Who knows? Maybe you thrive in apps. I certainly don’t thrive there and actually I failed miserably and quit a language learning attempt(Russian) because I went with apps. Once burned not touching the stove again?

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The best step-by-step way to learn Japanese is the way that works best for you. People have given you lots of good suggestions for texts and methods. I think what will work for you depends on what kind of learner you are. Visual, Auditory, Tactile. I suggested thinking about the way you learn. What methods were successful for you? You mentioned that you keep going back to the basics. Personally, I think spending a little time listening to content that you like but barely understand can be helpful.

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