Comment here if you want WaniKani to add 5 more levels with the remaining Joyo kanji

Wanting more levels added is a matter of perspective I find.

As you start out on your WK journey, you think 60 levels is not enough. But, when you’ve done 60 levels, you think that’s quite enough. :sweat_smile:

SRS can only take you so far. In the end, you’ll have to take the big step into the real world of using Japanese without guardrails, no SRS, no Crabigator to guide you.

Don’t be afraid. Just use what you’ve learned and you should be alright. ^>^

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I restarted WK from level 60 after some months because I wanted to solidify with SRS for extra practice alongside reading native material. I think adding the rest of the Joyo kanji would definitely be a welcome addition.

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You have to add the items yourself though.

Those kanji were generally omitted from the Joyo list previously because they’re generally kinda annoying to write by hand. With the vast majority of writing now done on the phone or on the computer, that was no longer a concern, so they were added in. More than a few of the new ones are place names - for example, the 熊 from 熊本, the 阪 from 大阪, the 奈 from 奈良, the 栃 from 栃木, and so on and so forth.

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Having now pretty much gone through WK twice, I can say that WK does not prevent you from going too far. Getting kanji to guru level is not that difficult and at the fast levels you can spend entire hours doing nothing but reviews every day just to keep up with the pace.

At later levels it’s also not nearly as easy to learn and retain kanji as it is at, say, level 17. There are far more things to know and to confuse, the kanji get more complex and abstract, and items that you keep forgetting over and over start leeching up more and more time. Not to mention that at later levels the mnemonics on WK are IMO far less useful and the examples less helpful.

Also, in my experience, once you get a certain amount of kanji knowledge under your belt, it’s easier to start learning unknown kanji as you repeatedly come across them. And of course you can hand-pick the items you want to learn based on how useful and frequent they are. You don’t even necessarily have to specifically put effort in it. Every book or game I finish I get some kanji meanings and readings pretty much for free just through repetition or by seeing a highly memorable instance of them.

Speaking of which, reading is one of the most effective spaced repetition systems there is, since not only are you seeing the words and kanji organically and in different contexts, you’re invested in it emotionally and therefore can create more memorable connections than by mnemonics alone. When I started to go through WK the second time, I actually noticed that I remembered kanji and vocabulary much better in connection with the things I had read, since I could tie them to my experiences and specific examples.

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Actually, yeah, this sounds pretty good, provided there’s a way to make them ‘fit’ into the earlier levels (putting kanji of similar complexity or frequency together, perhaps?). It seems feasible anyhow.

I’ve never used the SRS, but I just wanted to say that I find this is true as well: words for which I have specific, vivid experiences and examples, especially quotes from anime or books, are the ones I remember best, and with little additional effort (e.g. mnemonics) on my part.

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Yeah, I’m not gonna say you can’t learn japanese without SRS, because you definitely can, but those two words you gave I didn’t make a mnemonic for and SRSed them a long ass time ago and never forgot them. All and all, per word I probably spent like sub 60 seconds of my life on them. I don’t think the efficiency argument is one that will hold up very well, but yeah, you can definitely learn without srs just fine.

I do agree with linking words to other things, but I think you miss the biggest part which is usually just other words in japanese. If you truly have a feeling for some words, then its very easy to develop a similar deep feeling and understanding of any word that uses them in its japanese definition. Using the english definition wont do that. But with the japanese one you can build your way up kinda and see how words relate to eachother better.

Yeah, for real. Finish WK and see if you’re still saying the same thing.

TBF the joyo kanji list isnt complete either, nor is any list for someone who wants to get a high level in reading. Even for just vocab and kanji and excluding grammar, WK is a minority of what youll need. If I’m being entirely honest, I don’t think a majority of the people who make it to that point anyways will look back and think wanikani was a great use of their time past level 50 regardless.

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I intentionally left that out because I wanted to be general. I said ‘things you already know’, including words in Japanese, because I know some people reading this thread don’t have that sort of vocabulary yet. My personal preference is to link words directly to other Japanese words I know, and I think that’s evident from my mnemonics thread. However, some people have difficulty doing that, especially in the early stages of their learning, so I didn’t want to give anyone pressure.

Including how to write them from scratch and how to use them? Recognition is one thing, but using them is another. Also, fine, I know you’re very experienced with Japanese, definitely more than me, but how many other people here have your experience of not forgetting with SRS? You realise that a huge number of the requests for help on these forums are related to people mixing up words or having trouble remembering them even with the WK SRS and mnemonics?

Also, you can accuse me of shifting the goalposts at this point, but let me be clear: what I mean by ‘efficiency’ is the number of days elapsed before I completely internalise a word. Perhaps SRS will allow someone to learn a bunch of words while spending less time on each word, but how long will it take before that word sticks permanently and can be used without any external references? What I’m saying is that what I do allows me to learn words exactly once and hardly ever require external reminders. Isn’t that worthwhile, at least from a ‘how quickly I can add a word to my active vocabulary’ standpoint? I’m not saying it’s the best way, but I don’t have to wait for SRS intervals to elapse in order to move a word into my long-term memory.

Finally, perhaps neither of us is representative of our respective groups of learners (with SRS and without SRS), but based on others’ experiences, here’s what I’d like to point out:

  1. I think the vast majority of WK users can attest to the fact that they have trouble with many words even with the SRS. There wouldn’t be so many discussions surrounding leeches otherwise.
  2. Memory experts who have mastered rapid memorisation techniques can learn large quantities of information and retain it for long periods of time. I certainly don’t know how exactly they do it, but many of them claim to have average memories. I think their feats alone prove that more efficient techniques exist, even if we can’t guarantee that everyone can use them (although their claims of having ‘average memory’ suggest that this should be possible).
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tbh, I am already satisfied with what WK provides, at this level 33 I can read more easily twitter and some books about entertainment, anime etc. Incredible how we learn in the process.

We think having those demoralizing review sessions is not having effect, but no, later our brain remember the words and we read smoothly.

Can`t even imagine achieving level 60 what I will be able to read way more without checking takoboto and yomichan.

What I wont know, there is always a dictionary, that`s how I learned English in the first place (It took many many years of course)

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I’m okay at where it is at now.

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Yes please! please add them! There’s no reason for them not to be there!

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Can we please change the “wanicani” in the title? :grin: @Huichango

I figure it’s better to ask for permission before editing other people’s thread titles :slight_smile:

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Yes, please add them!

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I think the site should be as comprehensive as possible, I say add them…

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whoops sorry just corrected it lol thanks!

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I would take EtoEto instead.

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I see what you mean, but I don’t think it’s fair to say that people struggle even using SRS so that’s indicative of SRS problems.

Nearly everyone using this site (not forums as much) is going to be a relative beginner at japanese. A good portion of them are going to be beginners at learning a new language entirely. I feel like a lot of people are also busy with other stuff in life, not always focused, etc. There’s a million reasons why things can be going wrong. But I feel like if you’re absolutely focused, reading the mnemonics, checking words you got wrong when you get them wrong, etc…you’ll have no accuracy problems. And then, by the time you’re done with wk your ability to memorize kanji will have gone up.

If you’re gonna criticize SRS, at least do it in cases where people are using it right. Looking at people who make threads about not being able to remember words is just asking for selection bias.

I mean, if you really want to train recall rather than recognition you need output. As far as input wise, that doesn’t really give you an advantage.

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as someone who hit level 60 a while back, i think that a few more levels would be a welcome addition. just having all this information in one place, your history of being correct or incorrect, and the handiness of being able to find visually similar kanji would be a pretty big boon.

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I find it very difficult to retain kanji that I’ve encountered outside of wanikani’s 60 levels. I would love for them to add new levels with more kanji.

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5 more levels? That would make it 65 levels. Why not add 9 more levels? That would be nice…

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