I’m reading along (I’ve read no further than the end of this week’s section)
I’ll catch up soon (I haven’t yet finished last week’s section)
I’m reading ahead (I’ve read beyond the end of this week’s section)
I’ve read this book already but I’m here for discussion
I have no intention of catching up or the club has already finished, but I’m using the forums as reference
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Vocab Sheet
Anybody should feel free to add to the vocab sheet. Read the guidelines on the first sheet- even if a word is not yet included you can use the spreadsheet as a tool to get help.
Spoiler Courtesy
Please follow these rules to avoid inadvertent ネタバレ. If you’re unsure whether something should have a spoiler tag, err on the side of using one.
Any potential spoiler for the current week’s reading need only be covered by a spoiler tag. Predictions and conjecture made by somebody who has not read ahead still falls into this category.
Any potential spoilers for external sources need to be covered by a spoiler tag and include a label (outside of the spoiler tag) of what might be spoiled. These include but are not limited to: other book club picks, other books, games, movies, anime, etc. I recommend also tagging the severity of the spoiler (for example, I may still look at minor spoilers for something that I don’t intend to read soon).
Any information from later in the book than the current week’s reading need to be hidden by spoiler tags and labeled as such.
Discussion Questions
Feel free to use these questions as a framework or a starting point for responses. I also encourage people to post their own discussion questions!
What sentence/passage gave you the most difficulty? Feel free to request some help, or if you figured it out on your own break it down for the rest of us!
What was your favorite new vocab word from this week’s reading?
Was there any passage that you found particularly intriguing? Did it resonate with you (either positively or negatively)? Was it surprising? Offer any insight or new perspective? Was it just beautifully written?
I can see what というのもあり probably means, but I couldn’t really find a reference for it. Is it a fixed sort of grammar point, or just an amalgamation of a few other ones?
The chat with the colleagues
「朝礼なんかやってる暇あったら、そっちをしっかりして欲しいですね」
I can’t make sense of this within the context. This colleague runs off to call home because of her feverish child, and then someone says the above. Is it supposed to be a bitchy sort of comment? “If she has enough time to come to the morning meeting, then she must have enough time to do her job well.” or am I missing something?
〜ないなら〜ないで....?
なんか、産まないなら産まないで、手持ち無沙汰じゃない？
What does 産まないなら産まないで mean? Is this a grammar point? I couldn’t find a reference for it.
I imagine the continued mentions of the Chiba experiment must be a Chekhov’s gun, surely?
That section talks about how their company’s support system for working parents is lacking. If they (the company) have the time for a meeting every morning, they’d rather that time went into creating better employee benefits.
There’s this one for 〜なら〜で (link to a nihongosensei article). It’s using a negative verb in this case, but works about the same, I think. Unless someone finds something about the negative meaning something else. In this case it’s a 判断 that comes after.
I’d say it’s a common amalgamation (of particles/verbs?) / a common phrase, but I wouldn’t call it a grammar point in and of itself.
It’s basically stating several reasons for something. 会社が狭い, and there’s also the fact that デスクでの弁当禁止, and that’s why […].
Mmm, I struggled with this week’s reading. The conversation with the work colleagues and with the husband seemed very repetitive to me. It seems that we are hearing from various people the same points about marriages and parenting being separated from sexual attraction, and hence normalising 'friendship marriages, and same sex marriages. [That is the message in the text, though of course there is no reason that same sex marriages need to be asexual in the way that is being inferred here]
(I enjoyed the brief flirtation with the hunky neighbour with a taste for Mallory Towers-style children’s literature. I hope that he comes back)
I highlighted one passage in the conversation with the husband, who seems a bit depressed about his rocky relationship with his current lover. Amane likens their talk about marriage to a form of religious brainwashing. They seem to find some consolation in reciting or parroting the views of their society about ‘normal relationships’ [ie asexual marriages]. But I get a sense that even if Amane is happy to conform at the moment, that she is going to rebel.
[I think that Murata is deliberately inverting some of こっちの世界’s conventions (ie monogamous heterosexual marriages), and implying that there is a certain about of brainwashing going on in our own world.
I really liked the interaction with the neighbor, and noticed Amane’s notice of his physical features… Super surprised that they got so far as to exchange apartment numbers, I think that’s extraordinary for Japanese. This neighbor seems to be quite open and looking for contact. I had the same hunch as Amane’s husband, that she might find another lover soon!
I also thought it was quite interesting how much he is interested in her love affairs and that he really seems to get comforted by them. This is very close to polyamory in my understanding, except the fact that Amane and her husband are not in a love relationship… Strange and very interesting world.
This is something that surprised me about the novel’s world too.
My feel for the trend of less and less sex in Japan, is that due to the pressures of modern life (work, overtime, economic, difficulty socialising, etc.) dating is less and less appealing. But, in contrast to this, this work seems full of dating at every opportunity, and despite that still sexless.
Until tomorrow, at least.
That was fast!