On and off with Japanese

[amynata07]

Thank you so much for that I will look into it and get back to you. It might be a while, We all have lives outside of learning japanese. fellow 5.

[KrispyWulf]

Thank you so much for all your replies everyone. I really feel grateful for this as it means a lot. The feelings of frustration recently have been quite overwhelming and just reading your replies and similar experiences comforts me.

I am going to see how my classes with the Verbling instructor goes and hear what he recommends. I think I am going to then start a Study Log here on WK forums.

I’m going to see if I can reply to everyone in this post! You all raised so many good points that I must share my thoughts haha. So here it goes:

On the topic of slow and steady:

I think I absolutely am going to try and stick to this mantra more consciously. That being said, it’s tricky. A trap I fall into is that if I don’t feel some sort of accomplishment of progress (let’s say every month or two) then it’s hard to keep the discipline and it’s easy to forget that progress is being made by the sheer act of working on it even if it’s not visible. Haven’t found a good solution for this yet but I do still believe that everyone here is onto something when they say go slow and steady.

@fallynleaf

It can be difficult to motivate yourself to work through a textbook, but if you’re meeting with an instructor, that person could help keep you accountable. I think the danger comes from having to build your own study schedule and giving yourself way too much to work on

…

Some people on this forum hate textbooks and recommend immersing yourself in native materials as soon as possible as a primary way of learning, but I’ve found that immersion is way more effective for me if I combine it with more structured learning, so I’m not planning on trying to read manga or graded readers or anything until after I’ve at least completed the first book of MNN (which’ll put me about at N5 level, grammar wise). The truth is, there’s not really one perfect way of learning that works for everyone. Some people have used textbooks and learned Japanese really effectively. Other people had a terrible time with textbooks and found success through other methods.

Honestly, I haven’t given much thought to the whole Textbook vs Immersion approaches. I do agree with you in that whenever I have tried to read graded readers and learn grammar and vocab on the fly it’s been hard to keep up. I have tried textbooks as well (specifically Genki) and it has been useful but slow going. I think the best thing would be if my instructor could read along with me and use it as a base off which we can discuss the grammar points involved and practice some sentences/speaking. That’s my hypothesis at least, won’t know until I try though.

@ccprince

Once upon a time, I thought, “You know, that Murakami book looks really interesting, but wouldn’t it be cool if I waited, and read it in Japanese?” Ten years later, I can stumble my way through a Level 3 graded reader. So, I figure I’ll manage that novel in … oh, about eighty or ninety more years…

Haha YESSS. I had the exact same thought. Man, I really relate to your story haha. I don’t think I’m going to check the receipt for my Genki textbook. I think it’s a year or two after you bought yours but I’m going to close my eyes and not think about that

@Killua099

Frankly, you’ll lose more by taking a total break compared to learning a few words or re-reading your favorite book/article since you’ll eventually be forgetting the words/grammar points that you just learned. It’s better to slow down your pace than to totally stop and restart.

Lastly, find something enjoyable to do with the language and don’t use each interaction with the language as “study”.

Thank you for the advice. I’m going to remember this if I feel like I am going to stop again. At the very least I will just continue on with my WK reviews (even if I don’t do any lessons). I do not want to hard stop again at all.

[KrispyWulf]

@irabuyu

It’s a long way and that’s the best part. It means there’s that many interesting things to learn about!!

I love the optimism! I think I’m going to print that sentence and stick it somewhere near my desk.

@Kanamana66

Doing things that you despise will make you burn out. Also there is no point in talking, you’ll most likely develop bad habits, what are you really going to talk about? How hot the weather is? Nah, wait with the talking until you feel ready. The key is to make it fun and blend in some needed hard work.

Haha back when I was last studying I was talking about food and weather a lot with my instructor hahaha. It was starting to get a bit mundane . I need to start thinking about what would make my learning fun (even though it won’t always be fun). Anki definitely was not fun for me though haha.

@MinTako

Going into a textbook that is primarily in Japanese and just kind of getting out of that absolute beginner phase really helped my motivation leaps and bounds because I felt like I was finally getting somewhere.
I think if you’ve stuck with it for so many years, I’m sure you will get there eventually. And I hope that you can also make a breakthrough with a technique that works for you. I’m still afraid my study schedule will break completely when I start having to commute to the office again, but I am hoping the habits I’ve gotten into my system will be strong enough to stick.

Honestly, the word motivation scares me. I find it to be very fleeting in my life. I’m going to start going back to full time work in the coming January so I definitely relate with your concern there! I’m glad things are working out for you right now though. I guess breaking out of the beginner levels will probably go a long way in helping you stick to it when commute returns.

@meaniezucchini

The only time I studied consistently was when I was in college. Be careful not to burn yourself out though. If you need an easy week, it’s better to lower your expectations for that week and increase your study load when you’re feeling up to it than to push through and burn out.

Haha fun fact, I teach students at college now. It’s kinda ironic how as an instructor I am struggling with learning. Self care is hard, and especially hard to manage burn out when the workload and life goes in full gear for a few weeks in a row. I’ll do my best in reducing the study load during these times without completely stopping!

@amynata07

We all have lives outside of learning japanese. fellow 5.

Right?! Haha man it’s hard to manage everything in life.

[KyokaJiro]

Good luck @KrispyWulf san

[evandcs]

so far I have been motivated for 6 months on WK but because I was only focusing on it.

Just started grammar and doing bit by bit in order to not overwhelm me

but I had a moment like this in 2011 same as OP, when I quit learning japanese after using genki II, but now I am taking it serious. Now on level 21 I guess I have even surpassed what genki II taught in terms of kanji and vocab.

[nikosant]

I have a similar story. My interest in Japanese started when I was about 11 in 2008 and I had my mom buy me a textbook. Since then I’ve been on and off with my Japanese studies and quite frankly my interest in Japanese culture as well.

I’ve been to a few entry level courses and finished textbooks that are about the level of Genki I and II, in my native language. There is a real lack of higher level courses outside university degrees in my country, which means most of the work I’ve been doing alone. I’m now trying to get through Tobira and see where that’ll take me, but the lack of support systems is exhausting.

I try to find motivation in my experience of growth and learning. I’ve been to Japan twice at this point and have a friend family there whom I regularly chat with in Japanese, which helps with motivation and also recognising my progress. The difference in my language skills between my first and second trip there was crazy, especially since I had felt stuck with my studies and like I wasn’t learning anything.

I’m definitely more suited for structured learning. In a classroom, with a teacher, from a textbook, tests and exams, homework. This year I finally applied for a degree in Japanese language at the university, in the hopes of finding that kind of structure and a more academic point of view into the language and Japanese culture. Immersion I try to do whenever I can, but I am not particularly interested in popular culture, which seems to be the most used medium for many, and finding interesting content on my skill level is difficult. I believe it is crucial to do immersion on material that you find interesting regardless of the language, otherwise it will just feel forced and demotivating.

It’s definitely a long journey and sometimes it can be exhausting, but learning a language takes time. I began studying English 15 years ago and have been surrounded by it my whole life in TV, music, the Internet, literature, research, school courses and studying Japanese as well, but I sometimes still find it exhausting and difficult and I make mistakes constantly. There is really no end to language learning as languages continue to develop and there is so much even natives do not know. So I guess when we think of goals in our language learning, we should find something concrete and attainable instead of broad ideas of “mastering a language”.

I wish all the best in your studies.

[KrispyWulf]

I think I agree with you there, WK will be much more efficient at teaching vocab and kanji. I would only rely on textbooks to see how these are applied in writing/speaking. Do you think focusing only on vocab/kanji and having 21 levels worth of it under your belt is making grammar and genki II easier to work through?

[Nipad]

@KrispyWulf

WK will be much more efficient at teaching vocab

Although WK teaches vocab it is not aimed at teaching vocab, it only teaches vocabulary that uses the kanji that you learned to reinforce it. WK shouldn’t be your only vocab learning tool.

[evandcs]

I used genki II at a japanese university a decade ago. I really sucked back then because kanji was really hard and didnt stick to my mind at all with that book.

I learned bits and pieces of grammar that helped me with daily routine going to places and asking things.

With WK now at level 21, I can read news articles and japanews24 on youtube I can read the highlights on screen and understand many many things. Honestly, I get even more motivated going through WK and their vocab.

People here usually dont like wk vocab saying it is “all over the places”, but for me it is very useful.

[lkyvic]

May I suggest this youtube channel aiming at beginners?

Minori Education - N5・N4 日本語勉強チャンネル

Each video is short and well made. I found the explanation is very clear and easy to understand. Plus there are both Japanese and English subtitles so you can switch between the two. Throw it in to add some variations.

[KrispyWulf]

Thanks for sharing your story! I guess one of the aspects of learning something over a long period of time is that what initially motivated you may get outdated after a while (like your interest in japanese culture). I can definitely relate here. I no longer watch as much anime or play as many games, especially JRPG’s as I used to when I was in high school and uni afterwards. Honestly I find the words inspiration and motivation scary. They can be so fickle.

@nikosant

I try to find motivation in my experience of growth and learning.

This though! I can’t wait for this to happen. I was watching a lesson on japanese grammar on youtube the other day and the youtuber used some kanji in the lesson. When I realized that I could recognize them and didn’t need the furigana accompaniment, it was a massive surge of dopamine!

Best of luck with your degree studies. It sounds really fun and I hope you get the structured experience you wanted

[KrispyWulf]

I’ll definitely add it to my japanese resource list!