時をかける少女: Week 8 Discussion (Chapters 12 and 13)

I’m confused about a similar thing up here ! I’m still hoping for that twist.

@Naphthalene It was that やがて君になる spinoff book. It was depressing : p although it probably wouldn’t have been as depressing if read in, like, a couple sittings as probably intended. But my slow speed made it watching a train crash in slow motion.

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Starting reading early so I don’t have to read a chapter and a half in a night :confetti_ball:
Kadokawa Page 62
福島先生は、和子にうなずいてみせた
福島先生はそういって、和子にうなずいてみせた
Something small but I thought I’d check. I see てみせる shows determination. In this case 福島先生 is nodding in agreement with certainty. So it’s basically an emphasis of うなずく, coincidentally. Am I understanding that right?

Page 64
泣きそうになってたずねる和子に、福島先生はかえってふしぎそうな顔をむけた
There’s a few things that are confusing me here… 1) Why is 和子 qualified with たずねる instead of たずねた if she just said something? Is it to do with the fact that her たずねる was just a moment ago, and not quite in the ‘past’ yet? 2) Which かえる is this? :sob: I’m guessing 返る, so he’s returning something, the たずねる? Seeing as he goes on to ask a question. 3) He’s turning his 不思議そうな顔 towards Kazuko?

Page 67
頭の上にまで、すでに落ちてきている鉄骨を想像して、からだがしびれたようになっていた。
So I think this means “before/until it hit her head” but I don’t really know why… Obviously 頭の上 is “above her head” and まで is “until”, and I think に refers to 落ちる, but I don’t know how they come together

Suspicion (from 四日前のあの現場へ only)

I haven’t read everyone else’s suspicions yet because I’m not safe from spoilers. I find it really weird how 福島先生 offers to escort them home, and takes them past a construction site where a few days ago there was another incident… :thinking: Either he has a dark secret that Kazuko is threatening to release and needs to kill her off in the most unsuspecting way possible, or he’s lying. Personally I’d prefer the first one because it would be a nice twist :stuck_out_tongue: I’m onto you 福島先生! I hiiiiiiiighly doubt there was any 鉄骨, and disappointed that Kazuko didn’t realise, it would have been great if she had looked up and been like “urrr, no there’s not…” :ok_hand:

I’m proud of myself on this chapter, I barely looked anything up (only made 7 flashcards) and my questions are less “What’s going on!?!?” and more “did I understand this correctly?” :+1:

Thanks for all the help!~

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Yes-ish. The determination idea mostly comes in the form of conversation though… it’s a literal “I’ll show (you)!” kind of deal. That’s not really what’s happening here. This is doing something deliberately for show. Like, not necessarily inauthentically, just, you want the other person to see it.

I dunno. I’d say maybe because he’s turning to her as she’s asking.
Relatedly, The use of tenses in Japanese writing is something I haven’t wrapped my head around yet. I read an article years ago about how typically, the present tense is used when the action is not really moving, and then the past is used when something actuallt changes and goes forward. I haven’t really observed that though.

He was just talking to Kazuo right? I think he’s returning (metaphorically) to Kazuko after talking to Kazuo. I don’t have the book with me, though.

Yeah.

It’s saying that is already falling to までに her head. Well, that she’s visualizing it anyway. Take out the すでに and I think it will make more sense. The すでに is there to emphasize the “oh shit!” I think.

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Thank you! That’s really helpful :slightly_smiling_face:

It seems to be something you eventually get a feel for, like kanji readings and rendaku (although rules are there but aren’t 100%) :man_shrugging:

Oh oh oh :exploding_head:

Thanks~

:racehorse: Onward to 夜さまよう町かど :racehorse:

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Yay! I’m caught up! =D
I read the first chapter when we started… and then… well… er… I started again this weekend ^^;

I have read through all the chapters, and the forum posts. Thanks for all the great questions and answers!
They help me confirm I have understood what I got on my own correctly, and wow did I miss much, lol!

I’m still to a point where I only get e gist of it, but I feel I get more and more! this last chapter I seem to have gotten quite a bit! (as understood from the spoilery thoughts, I can tell I have picked up a good bit of what happened =) )

I don’t stop to look up much though, I could never catch up if I did :rofl:
I’ll continue this “style” through the book though. I’ve gotten my reading speed up quite good. Now I need to work on reading comprehension… =P

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I was thinking かえって might be the adverb 却って (instead, on the contrary). I haven’t seen it used in a sentence before (other than the reibun that comes with the 10k deck), so I wouldn’t really know how it is used. But the reasoning goes: the group is quite shook up and puzzled about the idea of trying a time leap. 福島先生 is not that way. He instead just has a mysterious look on his face.

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Yes, I definitely took it as the adverb 却って, meaning “on the contrary”. It fits with the sentence and none of the かえる verbs make sense there.


Anyway, chapter 13 was very easy. No questions from me this time. Though I do have some comments on the chapter. Technically the spoiler involves the picture in the Kadokawa Tsubasa version (posted by Radish) / the first sentence of chapter 14.

Why would Kazuko think there was going to be a second one of her anyway? There wasn’t last time, so it seems kind of contrived. I assume the leapt-through-time version of her “replaced” the original version, but I guess we’ll find out in more detail next chapter.

Would you say 却って is “on the contrary” from 和子’s 泣きそうになる face, and 福島先生’s 不思議な顔? Or simply an opposite attitude to the other three? To me it seems like the former but it seems to me like either could fit :man_shrugging:

This was all news to me and various dictionaries weren’t helping me get a handle on things, so I dug this up: 「却って」の意味と使い方を解説!「却って」を使った例文を紹介 | 言葉の意味を深掘る

It still doesn’t really click for me in the example in the book, but I think my brain is just being stubborn.

I think she’s just really confused, because she should be sleeping in her bed at this time, but now she’s outside dressed for school for some reason which makes it seem like she leapt through time bodily, which would normally imply her original self would be there too. But her notes are gone, and her original self is gone, so it’s confusing. I can only think of one explanation which I posted above somewhere, but we’ll see…

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I think it’s probably on the contrary to the 泣きそう Kazuko, but I’m not 100% sure.

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I don’t know if it works for you, but maybe it helps to consider the whole passage:

「ええっ! 」
「四日前に(戻るの)? 」
これには、三人とも驚いた。
「だ、だって、どうやって? 」
「どうやってだって? 」
泣きそうになって たずねる 和子に、福島先生は かえって ふしぎそうな 顔をむけた。
「 もちろん、タイムリープをやってだよ。」

Now try to replace かえって with 逆に (one of the meanings of かえって) :

泣きそうになって たずねる 和子に、福島先生は 逆に ふしぎそうな 顔をむけた。

It’s the same kind of 逆に (or かえって) that you find in expressions like “逆に驚いた” (or かえって驚いた). If you’re not really familiar with it, the best explanation I could find was here: 話した内容に相手が驚いたのですが、それが普通だと思っていた自分からするとその相手の反応に逆に驚いた。

So in our case, the teacher first suggests to change the events in the past, the pupils (and particularly Kazuko) are surprised and desperate because they don’t understand how such a thing would ever be possible, and than the teacher is the one surprised and wondering back, as a result, (かえって、逆に不思議そうな顔をした)because obviously Kazuko only needs to leap through time (もちろん、タイムリープをやってだよ。).

The かえって不思議そうな顔 of the teacher is a non-verbal expression of “Oh, are you wondering? No, on the contrary, I’m the one wondering, because I don’t understand what you’re wondering about. We’ve been talking about time travelling this whole time.”.

That’s at least how I see it. A less complicated way to translate it would be a “rather wondering face”, since かえって can have this meaning too (weblio, there are several examples but here is a good one).

I hope it clicked :slightly_smiling_face:

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Your use of the word “wondering” in your translations is throwing me off. I don’t think you can translate 不思議 to “wondering”.

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I agree with seanblue here, Sanseido defines 不思議 as “原因や理由がわからないこと” (main cause・reason being unknown), so it’s more of a “mysterious” or “suspicious” kind of vibe.
Kotobank is good too (#3) but I can’t translate it as well, too hard :sob:

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Why don’t you post more often! This was great, thanks! This does help it click quite a bit.

And 不思議そうな顔 does seem to mean wondering face, which is something I neglected while reading!

原因や理由がわからないこと, yes, but 不思議そうな顔 not 不思議な顔, so it’s a face like you 〇〇わからない, right?

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I just don’t know what a “wondering face” would be. :sweat_smile:

The face of someone who is wondering. Would wondering eyes make more sense? I think people say that in English
why am i not sure what people say in english im a native english speaker

Edit: I saw a translation somewhere that went with “mystified look”

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Wondering what though? As in curious?

As per @Elenakiyomi , wondering why the kids don’t understand how to go back four days in the past (どうやって) when they’ve been talking about time travel the whole time.

Edit: Examples of 不思議そうな顔 !

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I’m still not convinced that’s the meaning. Not that I’m certain I know what it means though…