Beat me to it, but I’m glad I wasn’t the only one to reach that conclusion!
the more you see it/hear it… it’s not dissimilar to English… (don’t know about other languages)…
but basically to fly away / to leave (disappear)… all the same feelings right… you’ll get used to seeing it more and more…
a Jp idiom: お金は飛んでいく (the money didn’t literally fly away)…but same idea/feeling.
Edit: I guess it could be literal if there was a giant wind and you had a stack of bills outside
It’s what @Jiell_1 and @MrGeneric suggested: ‘my sleepiness left me somewhat/a little’ (this translation feels kinda stilted, but it preserves the grammatical structure). You can get quite a lot of results for ‘眠気が飛ぶ’ in quotes on Google. Here’s an example sentence I found on HiNative:
(The food was) so spicy that (it stunned me and) stopped (me) from feeling sleepy.
I didn’t know this expression before – I just ran through the search results in Japanese to confirm what it meant – so thanks, everyone!
Halfway through the chapter (on page 8), and a lot of questions I’ve had have already been answered in the thread, thanks everyone!
Though I’ve seen others mentioning this line, I thought I would break down how I understood it.
「さて… どこにいるんだ、 高木さんのことだ。 いないなんてことはないはず…」
Now then… where are you Takagi-san. It’s not like you’re not here…
いないなんて = something like not being here
こと = nominalizer
は = topic marker
ない = not be
はず = bound (to be); expected (to be); should (be)
Putting it together, you get something like “it should be that her not being here is not the case” (they sure do love their double negatives).
You already discussed and answered, but I want to leave a couple of sources that I found useful about these points.
We also had some discussion about this use of ておく in chapter 2, and this video was shared which helped me to understand it (even though Cure Dolly’s videos are very difficult to watch for me :D).
So, my interpretation of that sentence was, it is a combination of ておく and volitional form.
After looking through the posts on this thread again, I realised that there was quite a discussion going on about page 5, so I figured I would jump in.
First of all, in order to get ‘nonetheless’ to fit, you have to split the sentence into two: ‘it was just for a moment. Nonetheless, I was about to (nearly started) let(ting) my guard down and hum(ming).’ I agree that it’s not the best translation here, and I think that ‘even if’ or ‘though’ are much more natural because they don’t break the sentence up. Speaking of translations, another suggestion for 危ない: ‘that was close’ would also work, and is perhaps a little more natural than ‘that was dangerous’, even if the Japanese word does imply a sense of danger.
Secondly, as you can see from my suggested translation above, [verb] + ところだ has a specific meaning, and that depends on the tense of the verb that’s in front of it. More precisely, there are three cases, which you can find on Maggie Sensei’s site:
- [verb] present (〜る・う, default dictionary form) + ところだ = ‘to be about to do [verb]’
- [verb] present continuous (〜ている) + ところだ = ‘to be in the middle of doing [verb]’
- [verb] past (〜た) + ところだ = ‘to just have done [verb]’
(時 and 場合 work exactly the same way with tenses, by the way.) That means that here, the speaker (almost definitely the guy in the story, whose name I don’t know… sorry) is saying that he was (だった) about to let down his guard and hum. He didn’t actually do it. If you want a more literal translation… think of ところだ as ‘on the point of (doing something)’, and now imagine that you can extend that ‘point’ notion to all other nearby points on the timeline, not just the near future.
Finally, while I’m sure this was just a typo… it’s 油断して. A 油田 is an oilfield.
I think it does indicate carelessness, but it’s not really a metaphor or anything… I’d say that the guy might just have a tendency to start humming while doing things, so he’s saying that he nearly started doing that. Yes, it certainly indicates a relaxed attitude – imagine someone humming while sweeping the floor – and letting one’s guard down, but it’s not a reference to anything so much as it is a common way for people to express their carefree attitude. That aside, perhaps humming would also have revealed his presence to Takagi.
It does seem to be N1 grammar, but I’m pretty sure I learnt this quite early on in my Japanese journey, perhaps around the time when my knowledge of Japanese grammar in general was around N3 or a low N2. It only looks scary because there’s a lack of explanation on all resources for foreign learners, and that might be because it involves Classical Japanese grammar. That might sound even more horrifying, but the irony of it all is that you can reduce the basic grammar behind it to two much simpler expressions – though that might erase a few nuances – that are N3 grammar at the worst: 〜ても and が・けれども. My preferred substitute is definitely 〜ても, but anyway, let me stop speaking in abstract terms and break it down:
とはいえ is an abbreviated form of とはいえど, which is the same as とはいえども. と and は are the particles that we’re all familiar with. いえ is the 已然形 (realis form) of 言う. What the realis form expresses is fact that something has already happened or that it is confirmed: 已然 literally means ‘already so’. When the 已然形 is combined with ど, the result means roughly the same thing as が・けれども or 〜ても. (By the way, I’m not sure if you’ve noticed after what I just said, but けれども also ends in 〜えども… so yes, it’s also descended from this same 已然形+ど（も）structure from Classical Japanese. It’s not just a meaningless four-kana particle.) As such, ‘translating’ 〜とはいえ literally into modern Japanese would give us 〜とはいっても, literally ‘even if one says ~’. It’s not too hard to remember if you know that the 〜えども form exists. You can just tell yourself
〜えども → 〜ても
Not all higher-level grammar points can be broken down like this – some of them have to be learnt as monolithic blocks – but quite a few of them can. It’s just because everyone reduces them to ‘grammar points’ with specific meanings and stops asking why they mean what they do that Japanese grammar knowledge is so frightening and fragmented. For another example, take 〜てはいられない. If you can remember what this means as is, good for you. If it’s confusing though… just realise that it’s the て-form + は + the negative potential form of いる. In other words, it’s just 〜ている, which is N5 grammar, and if you can’t ‘stay in the state of 〜’, which is exactly what 〜ている means, then you ‘can’t keep 〜ing’, which is what 〜てはいられない – a so-called N2 grammar point – means.
That was incredibly helpful. I appreciate the in-depth explanation on とはいえ. It was much better than any of the explanations I could find while searching. Thank you so much!
That was indeed just a typo. If I get going too quickly with the flick keyboard, I accidentally drag when I just mean to tap (it’s a habit that comes from using the swipe keyboard for my non-Japanese languages, and resulted in ゆだん becoming ゆでん), and since I knew what I wanted, I let it pick the default kanji in the list without looking closely. Should have double- checked, clearly! I went back and edited that. Thank you!
All my questions were already answered by the time I finished this week (guess that’s the advantage of reading on Sunday huh), so thanks for all the earlier answers in the thread! Some fluff about this chapter: How about Nishikata being too scared to even approach the desk where he thinks Takagi is hiding, in favor of waiting her out. I feel as though he’s been hurt one too many times at this point. And also that final scene with the two of them was really sweet, we were so close…
This is all going a bit too fast for me. Didn’t get much time for Chapter 4 - only got halfway through and haven’t even started Chapter 5. I think I’d best do it in my own time.
Obviously my grammar etc is not quite up to scratch for this manga!
What you can always do is still follow the boards and check in if you have any questions as you read at your own pace! I still have all the previous chapter boards marked as watching, and I’m sure I’m not the only one! Somebody will be around to help if you need it!
Pages 7-10, chugging along
Aaa. Because class duty work is such a bother, I will not do it.
I can get away with not wiping the blackboard etc.
How about it, Takagi-san!
It sure feels frustrating when your scheme fails. Hahaha
Imaginary picture in his mind.
Ooh, to see the frustrated face of Takagi-san.。。
Think and look!
Will Takagi-san make such a mistake to let her slippers be completely visible?
No! She won’t!.
Kanji on the blackboard: 最近習反語 recently learn irony
Basically, they are fake!
Oh, that was so close!
As one would expect from Takagi-san…
Well then, where is she, this Takagi-san?
There’s no way she isn’t here… // Taking from the forum thread
In the hallway…
Seems like no one is here.
In that case, what remains…
Hmm, go to the restrooms?
I’ll surprise her.
I though I will ask about this short sentence from Page 9
about よう part, but then I applied extra mental effort and found new (for me) grammar point:
ようだ “it seems that” that fit here perfectly.
Just bragging about my little win over Japanese grammar
Now the real question.
So what he decided to do about restrooms? Go and come back? Visit later? Have been there already? Feels like this part was glossed over
Regarding Pg. 9
I think he was intentionally vocalizing, “Heyyy, I’m going to the restroom~” in an obnoxious way, out loud for Takagi-san’s (whom he thinks is hiding in the closet) benefit. He intended to fake her out, then sneak back to the closet to surprise her. Though we know how that worked out for him. Heh.
Well done on your win! It’s always a great feeling, eh?
That’s it! Thanks!
For those who've reached the last page, and are wondering about this dialogue...
...it's a running gag with ミナ and サナエ.
ミナ gets her cheek (sometimes cheeks) pulled from time to time. This is where the ギュー sound-effect comes from in the panel from this week’s reading.
As less and less people seem to be reading each week, there are less people already asking the questions I have as well, so I guess I have to stop being shy and actually post for the first time haha. So hello!
I was wondering if someone would be able to explain しなきゃいけない from page 2 for me? My assumption is it’s a conjugation of する, but I have no idea.
The full sentence: なんで早く行って黒板ふいたり日誌書いたりしなきゃいけないんだ。
First of all, welcome, and please don’t be shy! The more the merrier! And the more questions are answered here, the better it will be for people catching up later.
しなきゃいけない is a common spoken contraction of しなければいけない
If you break this down, you get:
しな, which comes, as you correctly deduced, from しない, the negative form of する。
ければ which is added to the negative form of a verb (without the ending い）to basically mean “if not”
いけない, which means “it will be bad, it won’t do”, and sometimes is, confusingly, completely omitted.
So what you get is “If I don’t (do), it’s bad”, or, in more natural English, “I must/should do that”.
I thought this was the classic てみる (to try something and see), with も thrown in for emphasis and contrast, something like “Now let’s stop and think this through”. But now I’m second-guessing myself
I’m pretty sure that’s what this is, also, if that helps with the second-guessing. I read it as, “Think about it!” since the ろ made it imperative.
For those aren’t sure what we are talking about, here’s a link:
And the も particle as emphasis for good measure:
Edit: Well, I posted the second link in a hurry before I left for work and am just now seeing that is the one that talks about emphasis on numbers. I’ll find a more pertinent article when I have a moment today, but I’ll leave this one for now since it’s still useful, if not focused on this exact situation.
By the way, @AwesomestKat, it’s all right if this one is a bit difficult to understand at first. At least, I know it to me quite some time to understand it.
The good news is you’ll see this grammar a lot. You’ll get a lot of experience with it.
In the short term, it’s fine to just know it means “I must/should do that” (as @omk3 points out).
Over time, you’ll get used to it to a point where you have a feel for it when you see it, without thinking about it. At that point, it’ll be easier to internalize the “If I don’t (do), it’s bad” aspect.
I’m having a difficult time finding what I have read before on も emphasising preceding statements outside of amounts…
The 7th use of ても on the below link definitely talks about emphasising verbs, so maybe it’s related to that grammar rule? It’s a bit hard to peg because I definitely think てみる is involved here, but that も in the middle makes it a little different than how we would usually see it. If somebody else has a more satisfactory explanation on why it’s okay to sort of break up the てみる, I would appreciate it to sate curiosity!
I haven’t been able to find a specific mention anywhere I’m afraid. Interestingly, when I google “てもみろ” I almost exclusively get results with 考えてもみろ。 On the few websites that offer translations (not that I’d necessarily trust any of them), I see “Just imagine” or “Think about it” a lot. It almost seems like a set phrase, but it’s not mentioned as such anywhere I can find.