[2024] 多読/extensive reading challenge

@Ditto20 what were your thoughts about the writing style of the sayaka spinoff? I just started, but for some reason the author just seems to write Sayaka’s inner dialogue in a way that is harder to read for some reason. Like its almost like she is deliberately being more indirect and vague about things. I’m having flashbacks to when I first started reading and had trouble with japanese which can already be vague and indirect when compared to english.

After entering middle school it seems to have toned down a bit, but I was just wondering if you noticed this as well or if it was just me. Especially coming from the manga which felt too easy, this is a pretty pleasant surprise.

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If I just added WaniKani and Kitsun I’d get 7,000. I certainly know a lot of words not in either of them, but I’ve also forgotten a ton of words from WaniKani. It’s really hard to say whether I’ve learned more outside of SRS or forgotten more, which is the main reason I have trouble estimating. I suppose it’s probably somewhere in the 6,000 to 9,000 range, though giving such a wide range isn’t that useful.

I also tend to estimate my kanji knowledge at around 1,500, since I assume I forgot a lot from WaniKani. Maybe one day I’ll do the self study quiz on all WaniKani kanji to get a better approximation of how many I remember. Maybe I remember more than I assume, and I have learned a few dozen kanji outside of WaniKani, at least in the context of specific words.

I also still haven’t formally studied all N3 grammar, let alone N2 or (:grimacing:) N1. I find grammar trips me up a lot less than lack of vocab, so I don’t commit time to it. But there are a few recurring grammar points that I really struggle to remember for some reason. Not to mention I could be misunderstanding some things (or at least missing some nuance) without even realizing it because I don’t have a better grasp of the grammar.

In short, sometimes it feels like a miracle that I can actually read anything! :sweat_smile:

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Thats accounting for forgotten words, right? Because if we are talking about words we have learned on srs (anki+koohi+WK) I am way past 12,000 and there’s no way I know nearly as many words as you.

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Hm, true. I just looked at my old anki deck and I have 9000+ (9081) words and 1800+ (1823) kanji cards. I think I consider it to be 1500 to account for stuff I didn’t properly learned or remember (I have 150 leeches for kanji alone).
I don’t remember how, but I estimated that I only learned ~1000 words on WK, bringing it to 10000, and I have another 3000 cards on Floflo for a total of 13000.
Of course, I kept learning stuff from immersion since then (like, 宦官 is not in any of those decks, neither is 医師 I think, just to take the example of one of the most recent series I read), so those numbers, which were suspicious at best to begin with, are probably wildly inaccurate.

Well, it’s useful in the sense that I can tell you I got N2 with that vocabulary range. Same for kanji knowledge.

Hm, honestly, that might be enough. I don’t know if you even care about attempting N2, but I guess it would not take much effort for you. You don’t need 100% to pass, actually I think the N2 only requires 50%. Even if your theoretical grammar knowledge is abysmal, you can probably more than cover for it by crushing the reading section (like some rainbow turtle shell).

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I’m probably not noticing it as strongly anymore since I’ve read like… counts… 13 books by the same author so I don’t know if I still remember anything specific about the writing of the Sayaka books in particular, but yeah, I’d also say the guy has a somewhat unique writing style, especially when writing characters’ monologues. There was one book in particular(the second half of エンドブルー) that took more thought than usual for me just because of how it was written in a very very abstract way and the story itself also was kind of surrealistic in the first place too.

For the actual prose itself I don’t think I can do a much deeper analysis than to say that the actual vocab and grammar used itself isn’t very complicated most of the time but I’ve seen some Japanese reviews for the author’s books comment on how he has a kind of unique writing style as well so it’s probably just not you and me that think so (apparently he’s managed to build a bit of a fanbase partially because of it too. That, and very consistent characters.)

A bit less relevant to the Bloom into you spin-off, but regarding the author’s books in general…

…in terms of his writing more generally (since that’s what I actually remember enough about to comment on) I’d say he doesn’t really do the thing some other light novel authors do where they explain what a character thinks in way too much detail instead of just letting you think for yourself (not nearly as much compared to other stuff I’ve read, at least). Or well, sometimes they’ll give their reasoning, but… while it won’t be as noticeable for the Sayaka light novels which only has a single fairly reliable narrator, he also really likes to describe the situation only in the way the viewpoint character would see it, including biases, their emotional state at the time, focusing on the details they would care about most only, etc (in other words the guy’s clearly a fan of unreliable narration… though more in the sense of the characters themselves not being perfect robots that can look at things 100% objectively rather than actually intentionally lying about anything, even if the end result is similar).

Oh, and he also really likes writing occasional random things that initially seem to come completely out of nowhere :laughing: (like randomly inserting an alien into an otherwise very realistic romance, that kind of thing). Aside from that I think I’ve read absolutely zero books by him where there’s not at least one comment about what a character thinks about certain Kanji or some other language-related thing.

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Kanji is one I would have no idea how to even estimate. Do you go in depth when you come across a new kanji or do you just kinda memorize it for the word? Just off the top of my head, when I came across 驟雨 never bothered to look up readings or the meanings for 驟, I was just like ok 驟雨 means means so and so and its read like so and so. I actually don’t think I’ve bothered to learn a single isolated reading or meaning for a kanji after I completed WK and just assumed everyone else does the same. Now that I think about it, I have an idea for how I could see the amount of unique kanji I have for the words I know…I’ll have to give it a try later

EDIT: Currently I have “learned” 2526 kanji. The actual number of learned kanji is a bit more since the list of words I used isn’t completely updated, but obviously I wouldn’t be able to perfectly recall all 2526 in the words I know them in anyways.

Oh absolutely, thats the best part. Vocab wise its pretty normal. Grammar wise I actually have still yet to see anything new. And yet its difficulty is not the sum of those parts. I feel like there’s also a bit of a disadvantage by having the mindset of a learner. Like sometimes stuff just seems too vague, weird, or random and I’m immediately like “ah its just me not understanding something” rather than me realizing “ah no, the author is actually just saying something really weirdly here”. I really like sayaka a lot more though so far after reading this. There’s like something almost off putting about the way she thinks and acts but I can’t put my finger on it. Its like on paper she seems to have some solid core, but everything just seems to hint that that entire core is on the verge of collapse. Which…I mean I’m pretty sure is the entire point, but maybe not and its just me that thinks that.

So far I’m liking it!

Of all 13 books you’ve read by this author, was there one that stood out the most or that you would call your favorite?

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I do the same. I don’t really see the point in learning kanji in isolation after you have a good foundation.

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Most of the 13 have been parts of series so it’s hard to just name a singular favourite book(I mean, 9 of them are kind of just different volumes of the same series :laughing: ). Maybe not super helpful since most of them are parts of longer series, but as a whole my own personal ranking of books I’ve read by 入間人間 would probably be something like

  1. 安達としまむら 8
  2. 安達としまむら 5-7
  3. 佐伯沙弥香について 1-3
  4. 安達としまむら 2-4
  5. First half of エンドブルー
  6. 安達としまむら 1
  7. Second half of エンドブルー
  8. 安達としまむら 9

Though it’s not like I particularly minded reading any of them, including those at the bottom of the list(and as you probably can guess from the list the ones I’ve read are pretty precisely just the author’s yuri books, minus one or two I haven’t read yet. I also have a couple of his other non-yuri books but haven’t gotten around to them yet. For instance I got all the volumes of 嘘つきみーくんと壊れたまーちゃん used, which there’s even a live-action film adaption of it, which probably means it’s pretty popular/well-liked even if the film doesn’t seem to be very good)

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I’ve been really slacking on updating my progress here. It’s kind of funny to suddenly up the number by 120 pages though :sweat_smile:

I gotta say though I feel like I’ve put myself between a rock and a hard place. I thought taking a break from manga would help me prioritize reading 本好きの下剋上 3, but since I only have the paperback I can’t read while I’m falling asleep, which I’m starting to realize is where I actually get a lot of my reading done. Part of me wants to be a stickler and start another novel (on my ereader) in parallel until I finish, but I feel like that might be more than I want to deal with right now…

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I think you are both underestimating a lot :thinking:. If we talk about mostly passive understanding in context. Several friends who tracked their known words from the start (of course not that accurate, I know), said that at 12k words they really started to have a lot easier time in reading, and you are both well past that point. I didn’t track everything as accurately but had a similar hunch.

I feel the same. I have the 6k words from WK (obviously I’ve forgotten a lot, but probably understand the meaning at least on a lot of them), on floflo I have trashed about 11k words, and Anki shows me almost 6k words (suspended as known or in review). Those shouldn’t really even have a lot of overlap, since the Anki words are exported from floflo filtering out known words.

But that would be well over 20k :thinking: (even if you would account for a few thousand misparses) Not saying I have a perfect recall of every card :sweat_smile: , but at least “know” it at some level. Especially since these are all words I’ve seen in context, in books. Of course there’s the problem of defining ‘a word’ so everything is highly inaccurate.

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I have it on reliable sources that it stretches at least 4 weeks - provides you don’t turn on the wifi. I really wanted to do that, which turned out to be a huge motivation to read lots of 黒執事. My book reading suffered, but I read the 30 volumes within 31 days (plus one other manga I’d started previously), which is… The fastest I’ve read manga so far, and likely for a good while in the future too. I would have liked to read it a bit more leisurely, and spent some more of my reading time with my novels.

some thoughts on 黒執事

I wasn’t expecting to like it as much as I did. When the limited free time officially ended I had read the first 5 volumes, and was a bit meh about it. The art is beautiful throughout, and I liked it well enough to continue (for free), but wouldn’t have paid money to do so. Especially not since I knew there were 25 more volumes! :see_no_evil: By volume 10 I was sold. I think around that time the motivating forces behind some characters began to become clearer, and everyone gained much more depth as the story went on.

And then around volume 15 I was starting to feel really bad about cheating the author, but 30 volumes is a lot of money.
I’ll be supporting the author beginning next volume!

Now I’m sad since I saw that the average amount of volumes released per year is… 2. Between volumes 29 and 30 there was almost a whole year’s break, even! It looks like this might be the last major arc though, so… I’ll be looking forward to the grand finale next year, or maybe 2023? :crazy_face:

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Next to The Great One.

Screenshot 2021-02-09 at 22.15.24

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Alright @valkow lets go, me and you vs @morteASD and @Naphthalene

V gang rise up

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(looks at our potential sparring partners) (looks at all the reading I’ve been doing in English)

… … Sure! I have no doubt of our v for victory!

Also, though of course this takes nothing away from my absolute confidence on this matter, I feel like I definitely know fewer words than @Naphthalene and I have 22k+ mature cards in my vocabulary deck. (Then again I have no qualms about adding near-to-useless-to-me things like many kinds of fish and birds and flowers, just because I enjoy learning them.)

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Me: All right, finally finished Bungou Stray Dogs’ Beast! Now, I’m not starting any new novels until the release of (also BSD) Storm Bringer.
Storm Bringer will be long (484 pages, is it even light novel anymore?), and I want to read it fast both to avoid spoilers from Twitter accounts I’m following, and because it’s centered on my fav character. So I need to have a proper rest beforehand. And anyway I’m also playing Disgaea 6 now, and I want to finish it before Storm Bringer too.
(I’m playing Disgaea games for the main plot, which is commonly considered weird.)

Also me: But Sayaka Murata’s 丸の内魔法少女ミラクリーナ has a pink cover… And it’s only 216 pages and short stories collection so stopping points available


@Naphthalene, can I ask you about how assault scene problem has been resolved in the next 薬屋 volume? I’m not planning to read the series itself, but after your description (and after seeing the included art) I became intrigued what was the author intent i.e. was it supposed to be romantic or creepy.
(I’m probably being overly cautious with blur here, but just in case.)

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One explanation may be a difference in added words. Like some people may not add words like 自問 because its like once you see it…you’re kinda just like yeah thats the exact meaning and reading I expected. Other people, however, may add that word. In both cases, both people may know the word after a month but only one had it count towards their wordcount when looking at srs stats.

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Oh yes, that makes sense. I also tend to add kanji variants if I see them enough in books and such and my brain isn’t picking them up naturally, so I wouldn’t say I know 22k+ words, exactly, either~

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Yes, my numbers are pre-WK. My last attempt before WK was with an RTK-like deck (although I ignored the mnemonics) and the kanji readings. I considered it okay if I could remember the meaning and at least one reading (usually ON). Using the number of cards in that deck is a bit arbitrary, since I had used another app before to learn (in a similar fashion) all joyo kanji.
Actually, I just realized that I also used a bit the beyond WK deck on kitsun, so I studied even more than that. I also stopped using it when I reached the end of WK.

Ah, yes, obviously, I mentioned that there’s a bunch of words I have only seen or learned through exposure. There are some words that I never learned but make immediately sense due to their kanji (e.g. 吐血, that one immediately stuck too :sweat_smile: )
I was not saying that I know 13k passively (it’s merely where I stopped tracking). However, the test I tried above gave words out of context and removed kanji on purpose. So obviously the number of words I know under those conditions is reduced.

… oh. Back in the days, I read up to volume 4 or so and dropped that series. I guess I should have pushed a bit.

Sure, do you mind if I rescind my rule not to count light novels?

Sure.

So, I’m still conflicted about that part, but she decided that it would be safer to take control of the situation, so she used her training (if you do not know the background, she was raised in a top class brothel, and has err related skills).
Once the situation is resolved (there’s no details beyond the fact that she started by kissing him and, through a natation from his point of view, that he “lost”; I have my own idea about what it means but it’s not made explicit), she goes back to her room and stays in bed for 24h. She also removes the 簪 he gave her before, but doesn’t throw it away like is her first impulse. She then avoids him for a couple months, then their relation progressively goes back to normal, including romance, although when they are just the two of them for the first time, her first thought is “if I screamed would anyone notice?”.
Overall, I feel it’s acknowledged that he did a bad thing. Sadly, he is also shown (at least just after) to not realize it was bad.

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No mf takesies backsies :triumph:

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What about those that BookLive list under 小説・文芸 instead of ライトノベル?
(That only gives me one extra, but I’ll take it)

More seriously, that’s something I’ve been wondering about after @Ditto20 mentioned the following:

In particular, 紅霞後宮物語 is extremely similar to 薬屋のひとりごと in terms of writing, yet the latter is considered ライトノベル. I could say the same about a few other books in there, like ビブリア, 万能鑑定士Q or 図書館戦争. In fact, at my local library, 図書館戦争 is the “young adult” section, which is their category for light novels. (ビブリア and 万能鑑定士Q are in the regular novel section, though :face_with_raised_eyebrow:)

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