# 正欲 💦 Informal Book Club 🦆

**URL:** <https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369>\
**Category:** Book Clubs\
**Created:** [September 24, 2023, 5:11pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369 "2023-09-24T17:11:05Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 1

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**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 24, 2023, 5:11pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/1 "2023-09-24T17:11:05Z")

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Hello! I’m kicking off the 正欲 informal reading club. This is an offshoot of the [‘Profoundly Weird’ Book Club](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E2%80%98profoundly-weird%E2%80%99-book-club/60942).

 ![image](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/original/4X/e/e/4/ee4f2c28340579c9c3890674e51c3e7c1e9f7464.jpeg)

**What is this book about**  
Japanese summary:

> あってはならない感情なんて、この世にない。  
> それはつまり、いてはいけない人間なんて、この世にいないということだ。  
> 息子が不登校になった検事・啓喜。  
> 初めての恋に気づいた女子大生・八重子。  
> ひとつの秘密を抱える契約社員・夏月。  
> ある人物の事故死をきっかけに、それぞれの人生が重なり合う。  
> しかしその繋がりは、"多様性を尊重する時代"にとって、  
> ひどく不都合なものだった――。  
> 「自分が想像できる＂多様性＂だけ礼賛して、秩序整えた気になって、  
> そりゃ気持ちいいよな」  
> これは共感を呼ぶ傑作か?  
> 目を背けたくなる問題作か?

> **English machine translation which I lightly edited because the machine got confused**
>
> There is no such thing in this world as feelings that should not exist.  
> In other words, there is no person in this world who should not exist.  
> Hiroki, a prosecutor whose son has stopped attending school.  
> Yaeko is a college student who has found love for the first time.  
> Natsuki is a contract worker with a secret.  
> Their lives overlap after the accidental death of a certain person.  
> However, this connection is terribly inconvenient for “an age that respects diversity”  
> The “diversity” that I can imagine is all I can admire, and I feel like I’m putting things in order,  
> It feels good, doesn’t it?  
> Is this a sympathetic masterpiece?  
> Is this a masterpiece that inspires empathy or a problematic work that makes you want to turn away?

As this is an informal reading group there is no schedule. Join at any time for discussion or questions. The sections are a means of referring to where you are at in the book. I do not have a physical copy so these will be % based. I also split the book into ２０１９年５月１日まで and から because the section titles include those but they make the table harder to read.

| Section No. | % into book it ends at |
| --- | --- |
| Unnamed first section | 2% |
| Unnamed second section, newsreport | 3% |
| 2019年５月１日まで。。。 | |
| 寺井啓喜、515日 | 6% |
| 桐生夏月 、515日 | 9% |
| 神戸八重子、515日 | 13% |
| 寺井啓喜、444日 | 15% |
| 桐生夏月 、443日 | 18% |
| 神戸八重子、395日 | 21% |
| 寺井啓喜 、365日 | 23% |
| 桐生夏月、311日 | 26% |
| 神戸八重子、267日 | 32% |
| 寺井啓喜、267日 | 34% |
| 桐生夏月、249日 | 41% |
| 神戸八重子、172日 | 44% |
| 寺井啓喜、154日 | 46% |
| 桐生夏月、121日 | 49% |
| 神戸八重子、121日 | 51% |
| 寺井啓喜、121日 | 53% |
| 桐生夏月、121日 | 57% |
| 佐々木佳道、89日 | 62% |
| 諸橋大也、23日 | 66% |
| 寺井啓喜、あと1日 | 70% |
| 2019年５月１日から。。。 | |
| 佐々木佳道、19日 | 75% |
| 諸橋大也、50日 | 78% |
| 寺井啓喜、51日 | 80% |
| 佐々木佳道、51日 | 86% |
| 諸橋大也、52日 | 91% |
| 田吉幸嗣、80日 | 93% |
| 寺井啓喜、82日 | 97% |
| 神戸八重子 | 100% |

## How do I get it?

[Bookwalker link](https://bookwalker.jp/series/413834/) | [Amazon link](https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/4103330635/ref=nosim?tag=natively0d-22)  
As a note there is an audiobook available for this title on both Audible (availability may vary by your country) and [audiobook.jp](https://audiobook.jp/product/266930).  
Those of you wishing to add this to your Natively library may do so [here](https://learnnatively.com/book/60b8676d8d/).

# Do you plan to participate in reading this book?

_Poll ([view on site](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/1))_

# Will you be reading physical, ebook, audio, or combo?

_Poll ([view on site](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/1))_

> **Names cheatsheet**
>
> | Name | Reading | Description |
> | --- | --- | --- |
> | 佐々木佳道 | ささきよしみち | 30 in 2019, suspect/ringleader, works for major food company, married, (spoiler for up to 18%) Natsuki’s schoolmate |
> | 矢田部陽平 | やたべようへい | 24 in 2019, part-time elementary school teacher |
> | 諸橋大也 | もろはしだいや | 21 in 2019, third year university student, dancer, beauty contest winner (準) |
> | | | |
> | 寺井啓喜 | てらいひろき | 40s, prosecutor |
> | 寺井由美 | てらいゆみ | 40s, Hiroki’s wife |
> | 寺井泰希 | てらいたいき | 不登校, 小学4年 at start of book |
> | | | |
> | 桐生夏月 | きりゅうなつき | 30, born in 1989, works at mattress store |
> | 那須沙保里 | なすさおり | 30s, works at general store opposite, aspires to get married |
> | 脇元 | わきもと | Saori’s colleague |
> | | | |
> | 神戸八重子 | かんべやえこ | 1st year university student at start of book |
> | 久留米よし香 | くるめよしか | 1st year university student at start of book |
> | 桑原紗矢 | くわばらさや | 3rd year 先輩 |
> | | | |
> | 冨吉奈々江 | とみよしななえ | mother (husband:dentist) |
> | 冨吉彰良 | とみよしあきら | son, 不登校 |
> | | | random volunteer, age 26 |
> | | | |
> | 広田亜依子 | ひろたあいこ | Natsuki’s schoolmate, now 西山あいこ(にしやまあいこ) |
> | 西山修 | にしやましゅう | Natsuki’s schoolmate, married to 亜依子 |
> | 西山莉々亜 | にしやまりりあ | their baby |
> | 渡辺かおる | わたなべかおる | schoolmate, married to 門脇 |
> | 門脇 | かどわき | schoolmate, married to 渡辺 |
> | 穂波辰郎 | ほなみたつろう | schoolmate, about to get married to 桂真央 |
> | 桂真央 | かつらまお | schoolmate, about to get married to 穂波辰郎 |
> | | Satoru Fujiwara | youtube commenter |
> | | | |
> | 高見優芽 | たかみゆめ | スペード representative |
> | 平野千愛 | ひらのちえ | おじ恋 producer |
> | | | |
> | 越川秀己 | こしかわひでき | Hiroki’s coworker, early 30s |
> | 藤原悟 | ふじわらさとる | 45 in 2004 |
> | 桑原真輝 | くわばらまき | Saya’s 姉、27 |

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 1:52pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/2 "2023-09-25T13:52:13Z")

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I read up to 6%. Interesting writing, not easy, but not too hard either. I’d say about 半落ちlevel?

I think it’s no spoiler to mention it as it’s also in the summary, but after coming across it many times, I still struggle to understand this trend of kids just deciding not to go to school, especially in elementary school. Where I’m from, many kids don’t like going to school, but it never crosses their mind that there’s even a choice. Middle school and up some of them may start skipping classes, but it’s extremely rare to take it so far as to miss a whole year of school. And it’s usually more as a form of rebellion against the “system”, than because of bullying or a general feeling of discomfort. Anyway, I don’t think I ever thought I could get away with not going to school, beyond briefly pretending to be ill. 😅

If there was any doubt about this being a good fit for the Profoundly Weird Club, I think this sentence from the prologue should help:  
私はずっと、この星に留学しているような感覚なんです。 いるべきではない場所にいる。そういう心地です。  
😁

Edit: Forgot to add, I wonder why we’re counting down to the end of Heisei? 🤔

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**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 25, 2023, 3:54pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/3 "2023-09-25T15:54:20Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> I read up to 6%. Interesting writing, not easy, but not too hard either. I’d say about 半落ちlevel?

Woo! Going fast! And I agree, I mentally placed it around ~37 and checking Natively 半落ち is graded at 39 which isn’t far off. This book doesn’t have as many metaphors and similes scattered throughout, but it loves long sentences and the vocab used is quite wide.

> [@omk3](#):
>
> but it’s extremely rare to take it so far as to miss a whole year of school. And it’s usually more as a form of rebellion against the “system”, than because of bullying or a general feeling of discomfort. Anyway, I don’t think I ever thought I could get away with not going to school, beyond briefly pretending to be ill. 😅

Yeah, the idea of just refusing to go to school at that age is also not something in my experience growing up in America. I will say that dropping out of high school wasn’t uncommon, though, and I knew a handful of people who did just that, typically in junior or senior year (which is to say, ages 16-18). Even then, it was drugs or pregnancy, not bullying.

> [@omk3](#):
>
> Edit: Forgot to add, I wonder why we’re counting down to the end of Heisei? 🤔

I’m up to 18% and I still don’t know for sure, but I suspect it’s either (very minor minor spoilers, second section at ~3%)

leading up to the incident where the men are in the park with the children, or it’s just a reference to 令和 being a ‘new age’ and this book analyzing the changing landscape of Japanese society. I suspect, based on what I’ve heard about this book, that the scene in the park is not all that it seems.

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 26, 2023, 12:31pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/4 "2023-09-26T12:31:02Z")

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13%. In the 桐生夏月 part, I only barely understood some of the dialogue - casual dialogue continues to be my nemesis. In the 神戸八重子 part, at first I was bored by the beauty contest stuff , but then was intrigued by all that was left unsaid. Why is she afraid of boys? Why is her house cold? Why does she need to prepare herself to face her parents? Why is her brother a hikikomori now? What happened in his room? I understand that she has low self-esteem, especially as regards her looks, probably as a result of her mother constantly comparing her to her “perfect” brother, but that can’t be all there is to it. Something happened. Abuse?

So up to now we have a public prosecutor with a son refusing to go to school. A young woman who chose to distance herself from all her past acquaintances/work colleagues, and does not want to talk about her love life (or lack thereof). In contrast, a loud acquaintance who is only waiting to trap a man by getting pregnant and quit her job for marriage (this too seems to be a common theme, and apparently it’s not even a secret to be only quietly talked about, wtf). And a student who lives in an uncomfortable home situation, hikikomori brother included, and who just found the one and only boy that doesn’t cause her to shrink in fear just by existing. 👀 Let’s see what comes next!

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 27, 2023, 8:54am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/5 "2023-09-27T08:54:06Z")

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All caught up! (if you haven’t read past 18%, that is)

So I looked back to double-check the volunteer’s age with the paedophilia articles, and while I didn’t get a hit, I realized I had missed a much more obvious connection. Tatsuya, the boy our Yaeko isn’t afraid of, was (or rather, will be, as the articles were published in July 2019, after the era change) one of the suspects. Hmmm. And as I read on, another one surfaced: Sasaki, the boy who suddenly changed schools in the middle of the third year of high school, and who was close, or at least shared a moment with Natsuki, is the suspected ringleader. We still haven’t come across the third one, I think.

I’ve started to keep a name list, as it seems I’m too quick to forget names. Let me know if you’d like me to share it here.

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**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 12:00am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/6 "2023-09-28T00:00:40Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> I’ve started to keep a name list, as it seems I’m too quick to forget names. Let me know if you’d like me to share it here.

I made a name list as soon as I hit the news article 😂 I’m _horrible_ with names so I knew I’d have to. If yours is tidy feel free to add it, otherwise I can tidy mine up. Will put either in the top post.

As for the people you mentioned:

Yep, I have 佐々木佳道 - 30 - リーダー - 大手食品会社勤務 – 桐生の同級生 and 国公立大学３年生の 諸橋大也 （21）-- 八重子のcrush (lol, I couldn’t think how to say that Japanese so threw in English), but for the final one I only have 小学校の非常勤講師である 矢田部陽平 （24）. I assume we’ll come across him in relation to 泰希, 啓喜’s son? But so far as I’ve noted he hasn’t been introduced yet.

Since you’re caught up to where I stopped I’ll begin reading again tonight 🎉

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**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 5:57am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/7 "2023-09-28T05:57:31Z")

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This is not a book to read when tired at night 😅 I read up to `寺井啓喜 、365日	23%`

I had something of a flashback to 嫌いなら呼ぶなよ during the scene with Yaeko where they were talking about their special commenter 😂 I don’t think she’s going to find love there, though. I wonder if her lack of fear of him is due to his complete noninterest in her/all women?

The next chapter was much more interesting. The random connection of involuntary tears during sex becoming intertwined with enjoyment of the act itself with ‘this criminal said he gets off on seeing water spurt’ made me laugh. I do wonder though why he needed to steal the knobs, though. Surely he could just get a sprinkler or go to water parks… 🤔

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 10:57am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/8 "2023-09-28T10:57:09Z")

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> **Also read up to 23%.**
>
> The Yaeko part continues to bore me. All this festival organization just leaves me cold.
> 
> I wonder what’s up with 天沢聖司 from 耳をすませば (is it a prerequisite? I haven’t read or watched it). That’s the second time he gets mentioned, and the first one was on Natsuki’s side, about a commenter on a Youtube channel she’s following. The commenter signing as Satoru Fujiwara - the 蛇口 thief from 2004. 🤔
> 
> > [@pocketcat](#):
> >
> > I wonder if her lack of fear of him is due to his complete noninterest in her/all women?
> 
> That’s what I was thinking as well.
> 
> > [@pocketcat](#):
> >
> > I had something of a flashback to 嫌いなら呼ぶなよ during the scene with Yaeko where they were talking about their special commenter 😂
> 
> Next she’ll be (嫌いなら呼ぶなよ spoiler) setting bags on fire 🤣
> 
> > [@pocketcat](#):
> >
> > Surely he could just get a sprinkler or go to water parks… 🤔
> 
> Right? I don’t get it either. Nor why this is supposed to be anything more than a fetish. I’m reminded of the group in the initial articles giving the kids water guns (supposedly so that their clothes would be see-through, and so they’d get a chance to wipe them dry). But seriously, if you get off on just seeing water spurt, surely it’s everywhere? Go watch a water fountain. No need for elaborate plans.

My name list needs a tiny bit of tidying up, but not much. ~~I’ll post it shortly.~~

The descriptions are in English, I find this quicker to find when needed. Feel free to edit if you prefer Japanese. I hope I haven’t included any accidental spoilers in there.

I have included people (well, one I think) whose names we don’t even know, in case they turn out to be important later. And I have a double entry for one person, because we learn about him from two different sources, and I felt that anything I could add would be a (mild, at least) spoiler. I don’t know. I’m sure this kind of thing will come up often enough in this book.

> **Names up to 23%**
>
> | Name | Reading | Description |
> | --- | --- | --- |
> | 佐々木佳道 | ささきよしみち | 30 in 2019, suspect/ringleader, works for major food company, married, (spoiler for up to 18%) Natsuki’s schoolmate |
> | 矢田部陽平 | やたべようへい | 24 in 2019, part-time elementary school teacher |
> | 諸橋大也 | もろはしだいや | 21 in 2019, third year university student, dancer, beauty contest winner (準) |
> | | | |
> | 寺井啓喜 | てらいひろき | 40s, prosecutor |
> | 寺井由美 | てらいゆみ | 40s, Hiroki’s wife |
> | 寺井泰希 | てらいたいき | 不登校, 小学4年 at start of book |
> | | | |
> | 桐生夏月 | きりゅうなつき | 30, born in 1989, works at mattress store |
> | 那須沙保里 | なすさおり | 30s, works at general store opposite, aspires to get married |
> | 脇元 | わきもと | Saori’s colleague |
> | | | |
> | 神戸八重子 | かんべやえこ | 1st year university student at start of book |
> | 久留米よし香 | くるめよしか | 1st year university student at start of book |
> | 桑原紗矢 | くわばらさや | 3rd year 先輩 |
> | | | |
> | 冨吉奈々江 | とみよしななえ | mother (husband:dentist) |
> | 冨吉彰良 | とみよしあきら | son, 不登校 |
> | | | random volunteer, age 26 |
> | | | |
> | 広田亜依子 | ひろたあいこ | Natsuki’s schoolmate, now 西山あいこ(にしやまあいこ) |
> | 西山修 | にしやましゅう | Natsuki’s schoolmate, married to 亜依子 |
> | 西山莉々亜 | にしやまりりあ | their baby |
> | 渡辺かおる | わたなべかおる | schoolmate, married to 門脇 |
> | 門脇 | かどわき | schoolmate, married to 渡辺 |
> | 穂波辰郎 | ほなみたつろう | schoolmate, about to get married to 桂真央 |
> | 桂真央 | かつらまお | schoolmate, about to get married to 穂波辰郎 |
> | | Satoru Fujiwara | youtube commenter |
> | | | |
> | 高見優芽 | たかみゆめ | スペード representative |
> | 平野 | ひらの | おじ恋 producer |
> | | | |
> | 越川秀己 | こしかわひでき | Hiroki’s coworker, early 30s |
> | 藤原悟 | ふじわらさとる | 45 in 2004, (spoiler for 23%) arrested for faucet stealing |

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**Author:** ![NicoleIsEnough](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/nicoleisenough/32/87285_2.png) [@NicoleIsEnough](https://community.wanikani.com/u/NicoleIsEnough)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 4:52pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/9 "2023-09-28T16:52:18Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> I still struggle to understand this trend of kids just deciding not to go to school

Thanks for mentioning this! Not a book I‘d want to read then 🤷‍♀️  
I think somebody had mentioned that earlier as well, as the book had disappeared from my wishlists already, but I guess I forgot that. So thanks for the reminder 👍

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 4:56pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/10 "2023-09-28T16:56:04Z")

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Is that something you avoid?  
The books is not focused on kids at all, if that’s what you’re worried about. All main characters are adults, and the subject matter is very adult too. It’s just that one of them has a son.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 4:57pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/11 "2023-09-28T16:57:04Z")

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If it impacts your decision at all, the perspective is entirely from the adults as @omk3 replied faster 😂 It’s a worry of the father, but overall isn’t what I’d call a major plot point of the book. TBH I’m still not sure what the major plot points _are_ 😂

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**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 4:57pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/12 "2023-09-28T16:57:45Z")

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Diversity, but not the kind you expect 😉

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![NicoleIsEnough](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/nicoleisenough/32/87285_2.png) [@NicoleIsEnough](https://community.wanikani.com/u/NicoleIsEnough)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 5:05pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/13 "2023-09-28T17:05:57Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> Is that something you avoid?

I’m finding that thought quite aggravating tbh, and there are so many books out there that I want to read that I don’t see the need to expose myself to it rn 🤷‍♀️  
But if the main story is not related then I am not extremely opposed, just somewhat wary.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 28, 2023, 6:15pm UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/14 "2023-09-28T18:15:31Z")

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> **Read up to 26%**
>
> I was about to comment on how very disturbing the whole youtube thing was, and how surprising that 電気あんま is even in the dictionary (as “pressing one’s foot on the genitals of a supine person while pulling on their feet” - seriously, why is there a word for that??), when something even more surprising happened. That’s not at all who I was expecting to die (not that I had any idea who would). How on earth might he be connected to the others?

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 12:01am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/15 "2023-09-29T00:01:46Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> I was about to comment on how very disturbing the whole youtube thing was

Several years back I looked into the rather disturbing world of child content creators(?) and how many of them would get ‘challenges’ from viewers, which to an open eyed adult were clearly fetish requests. Squishing bugs ‘challenge’. Take off your shirt and roll on a spread of legos ‘challenge’. And the comment sections were equally obvious. Likewise, I’ve heard that “family vloggers” get more engagement on videos with children in swimsuits/the bath/etc. It’s quite uncomfortable. 桐生 just reading the comments, knowing what they are, and being like, “oh hmm, rubber fetish?” but not caring is just…disturbing indeed. No better word.

> [@omk3](#):
>
> That’s not at all who I was expecting to die (not that I had any idea who would). How on earth might he be connected to the others?

Likewise was taken aback by that (and 桐生’s reaction, good lord she _is_ strange). For the moment I’m just going to assume 佐々木 killed him 🤷

I’ve read through 26%, but plan to read the next two sections tonight if I can. The following 桐生 section is _long_ and I want to focus on it tomorrow.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 29, 2023, 8:59am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/16 "2023-09-29T08:59:58Z")

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> **Up to 32%**
>
> So her brother became a hikikomori because he was teased at work for being inefficient and a virgin, and she fears all men because he was watching an illicit porn video of a girl her age? Not that it’s not super icky, but still I was expecting something worse. At the very least a hole in the wall between them, through which he was watching her, or something.

> **Up to 34%**
>
> It took long enough for Hiroki to realize that his son being exposed like that might be a bad idea unrelated to not going to school. 🤔  
> Why is who inflated the balloon such a mystery?

The next section’s audio is 70 minutes long! 😲

> **New names**
>
> 桑原真輝 くわばらまき Saya’s 姉、27
> 
> And we have a full name for the producer:  
> 平野千愛 ひらのちえ おじ恋 producer

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 3:34am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/17 "2023-09-30T03:34:15Z")

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Up to 32%:

> [@omk3](#):
>
> she fears all men because he was watching an illicit porn video of a girl her age? Not that it’s not super icky, but still I was expecting something worse.

Yeah, it definitely felt like an overreaction. Maybe because the age gap between them is significant the fact he was watching JK 妹 stuff was extra creepy? But all the same, I think this is a ‘book needs a tidy scene to point to for her issues’ more than anything. In real life I can see something like that being influential, but it’d be because it was compounded by lots of other things.

up to 34%

> [@omk3](#):
>
> It took long enough for Hiroki to realize that his son being exposed like that might be a bad idea unrelated to not going to school. 🤔

I don’t think they really grasped it to be honest. Maybe I’m just jaded by being on the internet a lot and for a long time 💀

up to 41%

I had to go back to check the earlier section where Satoru Fujiwara was mentioned because I was like ‘how could this event had happened while Natsuki and Sasaki were in school, but also while she is watching the kids’ channel? Turns out I’d missed that they called out the date of the article was 2004 🤦  
Also we finally have them both admitting they get off on water, but IIRC he’s married when he’s arrested? I wonder if they marry each other for that sweet, sweet social respectability.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 5:07am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/18 "2023-09-30T05:07:35Z")

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> **up to 41% (which is 39% in my version but no matter**
>
> > [@pocketcat](#):
> >
> > but IIRC he’s married when he’s arrested?
> 
> It’s Fujiwara who was arrested when they were in high school, and yes, he was married. We don’t know anything else about him at this point. Someone using his name is leaving comments on all the right youtube videos, but it could be someone else.
> 
> What are the chances that two people who get off spurting water are in the same class?
> 
> In any case, I once again fail to see what the big deal is. I get the attraction of water, I love it in all its many forms, and feel happier near (or in) water. The feeling isn’t sexual, but the leap isn’t so great. I mean, you can show you enjoy water (maybe toning down the excitement a bit) without being a social oucast. It’s harming no one. Now if there really is no desire for human companionship (sex and a relationship don’t necessarily have to go together, and possibly getting off the same things might make a good couple, if they also like each other), then they can just say they’re aromantic or asexual or something, which is a recognized minority after all. It’s not that we have to explain what arouses us to everyone we meet.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![pocketcat](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/pocketcat/32/422463_2.png) [@pocketcat](https://community.wanikani.com/u/pocketcat)\
**Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 5:27am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/19 "2023-09-30T05:27:18Z")

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> [@omk3](#):
>
> It’s Fujiwara who was arrested when they were in high school, and yes, he was married

No, I mean 佐々木 in the news article in the beginning. I just skimmed it looking to jog my memory and it says this:

> 佐々木に関しては否認しているようです。わけのわからない主張を繰り返しているらしく、精神鑑定に持ち込むつもりなのかもしれません。不起訴になったとて、勤めていた大手食品会社はクビでしょうし、 **離婚は免れないでしょう** 。

So he was married at the time of the crime, which is in the future.

> [@omk3](#):
>
> then they can just say they’re aromantic or asexual or something, which is a recognized minority after all.

I suspect that would be too much of a minority/inviting too many questions for their comfort. Natsuki seemed to be quite impacted by the way the class laughed at the man who was arrested, and both of them seem to have something of a complex around not feeling the same attractions as their peers.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![omk3](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/wanikanicommunity/user_avatar/community.wanikani.com/omk3/32/411137_2.png) [@omk3](https://community.wanikani.com/u/omk3)\
**Post date:** [September 30, 2023, 6:28am UTC](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369/20 "2023-09-30T06:28:46Z")

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Ah, you’re right, I got completely confused. In fact, we don’t even know if Fujiwara was married at all. I got the two arrests completely mixed up. I shouldn’t be posting before I’ve had my morning coffee. 😅

> [@pocketcat](#):
>
> Natsuki seemed to be quite impacted by the way the class laughed at the man who was arrested

From what I remember from my high school, it wasn’t the most tolerant place. In fact you only had to dress or speak a little differently, or not like the same kind of music bands, to be laughed at and ostracised. So the schoolmate’s reaction means nothing to me. The world beyond school is wider and more colourful, and you can always find people you get along with. In fact, she even found one right there in her class, unlikely as it seems.

In any case, the book seems to be about how we pretend to be accepting of diversity, when in fact we’re not, and uses this water fetish example to prove the point, but it doesn’t click for me. Totally average heterosexual couples may still have all kinds of weird fetishes, and that’s totally fine as long as they’re not harming anyone, but hardly the subject of polite conversation.

I guess the way I see it is like this: What arouses us sexually concerns no one really, other than our sex partners. It’s the falling in love part, and the choosing to formally be with someone, or choosing to never be with someone, that may be a problem, because society may not be accepting of same sex partners, or multiple partners or whatever. Natsuki is unlikely to want to marry water, (introduce water to her family, go with water to formal events, buy a house together with water), so society shouldn’t care about how she feels about water. What society cares about is that she’s not married or willing to be. Still uncomfortable, but less so. There have always been people who never married for whatever reason, in all generations. And nowadays, saying “I’m just not attracted to anyone” would be accepted by most, wouldn’t it?

[Next page](https://community.wanikani.com/t/%E6%AD%A3%E6%AC%B2-informal-book-club/63369.md?page=2)