時をかける少女: Week 3 Discussion (Chapter 3)


#21

Jesus Christ I legit stared at that sentence for fifteen minutes trying to figure out what “二ブロックほどなれた” meant.


#22

I was sure it was the katakana ニ instead of the numeral 二, trying to figure out what the heck 二ブロック was supposed to mean :sweat_smile:


#23

So, not quite. What it’s saying is that she feels like she can’t trust herself, because she feels like at any time she might do something nonsensical. If you look at the previous bit, and the next sentence, you see that she feels like she’s floating as well, and then describes her weird feeling as being more psychological than physical. By the way, しでかす has a similar meaning to してしまう.


#24

Inspired by the previous chapters’ discussions I actually went through the chapter properly this time (rather than just reading it for comprehension and moving on).
Went better than expected and after a bit of research and some piecing together, I understood mostly everything just fine. There’s just a couple things I’m not quite sure of:

Kadokawa, p.19

と、いってもべつにとこが悪いというのでもないし、気分が悪いというほどのこともない。

Although one might say this isn’t a bad thing, there’s also nothing that feels as bad as this.

(I honestly have no idea how to approach this, so I’m pretty sure I’m entirely wrong here.)

Kadokawa, p.23

黒い人影が、燃えさかる炎を空を飛んでいるのだ。かと思うと、きみょうにゆがみ、よじれたあの実験室が、和子の周囲を取りまいて、はげしくゆれうごいた。

The black shadow of a person flew towards the sky. (Where does the brightly burning flame fit it? The two を throw me off. And also I’m not sure if the 飛んでいる part refers to the shadow or the flame. I’m thinking shadow.)
Something about Kazuko’s environment (I’m assuming this is meant as her situation at the moment) being violently shaken up by that twisted lab (what happened there).
(what really keeps me from figuring out this second sentence is the beginning. What does か refer to here? The only thing I could find that fits is day or fire, but I’m not too sure. What is ゆがみ here? the only translation for this one I could find is distortion, but again, I’m just now sure how it all fits together)

So essentially I don’t get anything of this paragraph except that she’s talking (thinking) about that dream that she had.

Please enlighten me :slight_smile:

(also did I blur the right things? I’m so full of confusion right now)


#25

I think that might be the particle か, essentially attached to the previous sentence. I’m pretty sure they’ve already started sentences in this book with the particle と plus 言うor 思う. I’m pretty sure it’s not mosquito!

を with a motion verb like 飛ぶ shows what the motion went by/through, so probably having two in a row just means it flew through both?


#26

It says “Saying that, there’s no particular place that’s bad, and you couldn’t go as far as to say that she feels sick either.”
Or more naturall, “But nowhere in particular felt bad, and she couldn’t say she felt sick either.”

Also it’s どこが悪い not とこ but I assume that’s a typo

Edit: gonna go a little deeper in case it is necessary, and I’ll just do it all in spoilers.

どこが悪い = where is bad, どこが悪いという = say where is bad, nominalized by の, then negated with でもない. 〜のでもない often takes on the meaning of “it isn’t this” or “it can’t be this.” Here, it’s like “the saying where is bad thing can’t be.”
Or, she couldn’t say anywhere felt bad. Or, she couldn’t say where she felt bad.
If it had been something more like your translation of “one might say it wasn’t necesarily a bad thing,” it would be something more like 別に悪いことではないとも言える
Then, 気分が悪い means feeling bad in the way of being sick, and ほど is the extent. 気分が悪いというほど = “to the extent of (calling it) feeling bad/being sick”, all of which modifies こと, which is negated with もない.
Clearer?

A shadowy figure flew the sky and roaring flames - or she thought, but then the strangley distorted, twisted experiment room surrounded her, and violently shook.

It’s hard for me to think of where tk start breaking it this down. 炎を空を飛ぶ is a little outside my wheelhouse too, but after that…
かと思うと is being used like “as soon as she thought,” the か in this example possibly emphasizing that things change so fast she’s not even sure what she saw.

ゆがむ and よじれる are both verbs that describe something being bent, twisted, or wrong. 周囲を取り巻く is kind of literally “surrounding the surroundings” but, you know. It sounds less redundant in Japanese.

I know the whole paragraph is difficult because you can’t rely on your common sense to try and make up for the grammar you might miss, which we often normally do, because it’s describing a dream and makes no sense. Oh well!


#27

Understanding this sentence requires you to review what comes directly before it: The previous sentence ends saying that 和子は体の調子がおかしかった。 Then the next sentence starts with といっても (Saying that), which connects with what @QuackingShoe answered just above. Basically, おかしかった, but no particular place feels bad and you can’t go as far as to say she feels sick either.

I just checked the book because this sentence felt weird, and you missed something. The full sentence is 黒い人影が、燃えさかる炎を背景に空を飛んでいるのだ。かと思うと、きみょうにゆがみ、よじれたあの実験室が、和子の周囲を取りまいて、はげしくゆれうごいた。

The first を (attached to 燃えさかる炎) refers to 背景に. 背景 means background, so it ends up meaning that she sees the shadowy figure with burning flames in the background.

The second を (attached to 空) refers to 飛ぶ, and just means that the figure is flying in the sky.

So the first part, which I think was the bigger problem, now means that in her dream she saw a shadowy figure flying in the sky with burning flames in the back.


#28

I remembered reading を背景に in the book, particularly because I thought it was an interesting construction in the book, and then totally forgot about it for this question. Shows me not to grab the book when answering things.


#29

Exactly :joy::joy::joy::joy:

But thanks, both of those make so much sense and never even thought of it :joy: Thanks!

Thank you, the moment I read your translation and then re-read the sentence, I got it. But the breakdown was still really helpful.

Oh okay, that’s also an option. So rather than a particle, it’s actually… well, I don’t really know what to call it, but what you said. :grin:

Yeah redundancy is a thing in Japanese I guess, but thanks for clearing ゆがむ up for me.

Oh and yes, the

was a typo

Thanks for the hint. I think I did look back on it and then simply dismissed it :see_no_evil:

Of course it did :sweat_smile: Thanks for breaking that down though, it’s much clearer now.
I think I read it, was confused, noted it down wrong and got even more confused because of that xD

Thanks guys, that was super quick!


#30

I found “かと思うと” in jisho as: at the thought of; when I think about. It has another meaning as an expression but it has to go after a past tense verb.


#31

So then it becomes a direct reference to the image she describes in the previous sentence I guess. Clever.


#32

The か is the question particle か, I was just commenting on some of the nuance in the scene, sorry.


#33

I think I need to reread the chapter later this week for clarification, but does anyone know what kitchen is being referred to here? It’s page 61 in the tsubasa version ebook (no idea on the physical, sorry!)

火事はふろ屋の裏口近くの台所から起こったものらしかった

As I understand it, this is saying The fire appeared to have started from the kitchen near the bath house’s back entrance but I missed what building the kitchen is from? It’s not Gorou’s family’s store, since the next sentence says that’s safe, and I think it implied they live in their shop so if the shop is safe their house should be too but a kitchen in a bath house makes no sense either. Maybe I am overthinking it and it’s not important?


#34

That is weird, but since I don’t know how 風呂屋’s work, maybe they have a small kitchen near the back door for the employees? :thinking:


#35

I just assumed that it was the same as with 吾郎’s family and that people lived there… :thinking:


#36

@sigolino @Naphthalene

Maybe that is the case? I reread a bit earlier and there’s the line 。。。ふろ屋の煙突が、煙につつまれている。。。 The bath house’s chimney was engulfed in smoke. :confused:


#37

No, I think that chimney is the one for the smoke of the fire used to eat the bath’s water, like the one on the left here:

I thought for a while that the 台所 could also be the place where said fire is, but I couldn’t find anything going in that direction. (Arguably I didn’t look too hard either)


#38

I assumed the 台所 was in a building adjacent to the ふろ屋, but that the ふろ屋の煙突 was a handy landmark so that 和子 would know that it was close to 吾郎’s house.


#39

We should probably change the title of this thread to 時をかける少女: 台所 Discussion


#40

Just wanted to say thank you so much for this breakdown. I also struggled with that sentence and the breakdown really helped me understand why it meant what it meant!


Oof, that first page. I’ve read two pages and the second was definitely easier going.

I don’t think these questions have been asked yet…

All from Page 19 Tsubasa Bunko


The sentence where she talks about having no confidence in herself: is the もてない bit at the end from the verb 持てる, ‘to be able to possess’? Like “she wasn’t able to have any confidence in herself”?

自分に自信がもてないのだ


Not totally certain of the breakdown of this sentence:

だからそれは、からだの調子というよりは、むしろ精神状態といったほうがいいかもしれなかった。

“So, more than the state of her body, it would probably rather be better to say it was her mental state or some such.”

???


確信といってもいいだろう

“You’d probably call it a conviction”??? Not sure what いいだろう is bringing here.


Ummm, what does 三日のち mean??! Obviously I understand what 三日 means, but… what is this ち …?


Another good lesson in “if you don’t understand, try reading the next sentence” on page 20 - I was wracking my brain trying to think what on earth was going on when I read that her bed was going up and down??!, and then I read the very next sentence and went “ooooh, an earthquake…” :joy: