僕が愛したすべての君へ 📦 (Intermediate Book Club) ・ Week 17

That sounds good to me! Glad to hear the 序章 is a lot better. That’s promising!

If needs be, I can whip up a quick thread for it here in the next couple of hours, that way we at least have a spot to chat about it!

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Free will arguments

I think I understand what you are saying, but I’m having trouble seeing how it’s in any way a different interpretation from mine. I also thought about mentioning probabilities while writing my previous post, but in the end didn’t because I don’t see how they enter the equation.

My first objection is: I don’t see how free will is in any way “free” if your will is denied 1 out of 10 times, or in any other proportion. The author calls people “dice”, and this is exactly why I used the world “chance”. Sure, a person might be a “loaded die” that tends to land on 6 more than the other numbers, but that doesn’t matter. They will still land on the other numbers occasionally. They don’t have the free will to be number 6. They don’t have the free will to be the person they want to be.

My second objection is about your example. Let’s start with the part of “a world where person X robbed bank”. Let’s say the proportion of worlds where X didn’t rob a bank is 99.9% to 0.1% where X did.

This reasoning is flawed because you are looking at the parallel worlds from a biased point of view - you are starting at the specific world where X is an upstanding citizen. X being an upstanding citizen is not a natural result, it’s the result of his own decisions that have led him to this point. These decisions also spawned other parallel worlds. Worlds where he associated with the wrong people and ended up in a gang of bank robbers; the worlds where he became a drug addict and robbed a bank when they were high or needed money for drugs; the world where they were poor and needed money desperately to save a loved one… and so on.

If you have the parallel words as lines going horizontally, and you make a vertical line at the exact point in time where person X is 40 years old, in how many parallel worlds did he rob a bank and in how many did he not? X robbed a bank in infinite of them, and didn’t rob a bank in infinite them. And the proportion is not 99.9% to 0.1% - it’s simply immeasurable. It could easily be 50% to 50%. X doesn’t have free will - he’s forced to live all the horrible lives, he’s forced to do all the evil things, just like he’s forced to do all the nice things and live all the good lives.

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Response

I’m still not sure that equates to a lack of free will. From the perspective of any individual world, they still made the choices that led to their current life. It would be different I guess if all versions of the same person shared a consciousness. Though I will admit that Koyomi’s comment at the end kind of shows a perspective more in line with what you’re saying (though he’s obviously more positive about it than you are), but just because he’s thinking it doesn’t make it true either.

It’s funny you bring this up because in my previous post I was going to say something directly contradicting this but ended up not writing it. If you’re at all interested in math I recommend reading up a bit on set theory, particularly infinite sets and countability. The summary though is that not all infinities are the same. While you’re correct in saying that the person robbed a bank in infinitely many worlds and also didn’t rob a bank in infinitely many worlds, that doesn’t necessarily make them immeasurable or the same size. It’s possible for both sets to be infinite and uncountable and yet for one to still be provably larger than the other. (My understanding of set theory is certainly not good enough to try to actually apply it to a fictional work, but that’s partly what inspires my interpretation.)

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Alright, I’ve got the thread up! @WeebPotato

Also tagging @seanblue since you mentioned being interested in hearing people’s thoughts!

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Thanks for the recommendation, btw, and I see that there is an informal book club for it, so I’ll check it out.

Edit: link to the book club for easy future reference:

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I’m also reading through that series (albeit very slowly as a side thing), so if you end up posting in the informal club, I might do the same!

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:face_with_monocle:

I would’ve joined, but first need to buy the books…

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Well, if you do, you know you have at least one conversation partner. :stuck_out_tongue:

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Oh, bunny girl senpai has a book club. TIL, was meaning to read that, even have the book bought I think.

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I mostly didn’t like the book for all the reasons already mentioned here, and also one more…

First, my favorite part of the book was 和音 tricking Calendar. It was set up well, it was unexpected, and it told us a lot about 和音, and she was by far the most interesting character in the book.

Now, the thing I absolutely hated the most about the book was how her character was completely abandoned. The sassy, clever 和音 was replaced by nothing more than Calendar’s ワイフ, her importance defined, as I guess the title implied, by nothing more than her relationship to the narrator. I guess we figure out that he loved every version of her (which makes no sense as discussed above), but as far as I can tell, we’ll never know why he loved even a single version of her, except that she was a woman who talked to him at some point… It’s really impressive how boring she became. What a waste.

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Ah yes, I totally feel the same way. There were so many scenes in the second half of the book where she was present, but (inexplicably) basically completely silent and so many things that I would have wanted to hear her opinion on. Indeed a total waste of a good character.

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Which is quite interesting, considering the narrator would often remark how he observes the different aspects of Kazune and how all of them are meaningful.

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There was a lot of tell, and not much show. :frowning:

I agree the writing was pretty poor. Or not the writing as such, but rather the story telling. There were interesting aspects, and I enjoy a good story about parallel universes, so it’s a shame I couldn’t enjoy it more. At least it was relatively easy.

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