レンタルおにいちゃん Volume 2

Hmmm I see. That’s a very reasonable explanation. Thank you!

1 Like

Many many thanks @BarelyFragile for your breakdowns and @2OC3aOdKgwSGlxfz and @ChristopherFritz for the succesive discussion!! It´s amazing how subtle the grammar points and the nuances can get at some points, and I think It´s wonderful for the Absolute Beginner Bookclub because these difficulties (now alongside Kansai-ben) is what pushes us to the limit and makes us grow without turning the reading into something 苦しい.

3 Likes

Week 7: Pages 115–126

Start Date: 2021-01-01T15:00:00Z

When I planned out the weeks for this volume, I wasn’t certain how many people would be reading along, and what the general reading level of readers would be. So I wasn’t certain whether to split the chapter into two weeks or three.

This chapter is a bit dense on dialogue, so a bit more effort may be required those who are still fairly new to reading. As a reprieve, this week’s reading is only 11 pages (excluding the title page).

Vocabulary List

Page Numbers Guide (thumbnail spoilers)

Participation

Mark your participation status by voting in this poll.
(You can change your answer later if you’d like.)

  • I’m reading along.
  • I have finished this part.

0 voters

(I’ll post the Pixiv/commercial comparison for the second half of last week’s chapter later.)

4 Likes

@ChristopherFritz non-manga related question, but how do you do the detail tags?

When composing a reply, there should be a formatting toolbar above the textbox. There’s a gear icon. Select that for options to put details, spoilers, or build a poll.

Upon selecting the “Hide Details” option, the following is inserted into the textbox:

[details=“Summary”]
This text will be hidden
[/details]

Optionally, if you select text in your post before choosing the details option, that text will appear in place of the “This text will be hidden” portion.

You can also type the details tags manually, which is what I do.

1 Like

Thank you so much!

Changes from Pixiv Original to Commercial Release

This post covers changes in the second half of chapter 8, as it went from original Pixiv release to commercial release.

Page 97 Changes

97.1 64992928_p14 97.1 0821_rental_1280_02_099

Very minor change. The ending particle な was removed.

Similar changes were made earlier in the story as well. I imagine this was to give 慎 a less abrupt, more kind sound to his speech.

Page 98 Changes

Another minor change. The を in 気をつける became ぃ as in 気ぃつける, likely to emphasize 大吾’s dialect.

Page 99 Changes

99.1 64992928_p16 99.1 0821_rental_1280_02_101

大吾 originally referred to the open space as 丁度 (「ちょうど」), suggesting it was just the right amount of openness.

In his second line, the flying disc was originally referred to as a フリスビー. This was changed to これ in the commercial release. This could be because Frisbee is a registered trademark of a company called Wham-O. I suppose Wham-O has to be doing something right if even Japanese media companies know to not use their product name…

Finally, the verb changed from a (フリスビー)やる to あそぶ.

Pixv:「あっ 丁度広いとこ出たし。叶実ちゃんも一緒にフリスビーやらへん?」
Comm:「あっ ・・広いとこ出たし。叶実ちゃんも一緒にこれで・・遊ばへん?」

99.2 64992928_p16 99.2 0821_rental_1280_02_101

Here, 叶実’s line changed from saying she’s not very good at it (「あんまり上手くない」), to saying she’s never done it before (「やったことないよ」).

99.3 64992928_p16 99.3 0821_rental_1280_02_101

No dialogue changes here, but みすず’s pose was changed a bit.

Page 101 Changes

101.1 64992928_p18 101.1 0821_rental_1280_02_103

Another removal of フリスビー.

Removal of 叶実 saying her name when asking what she should do.

101.3 64992928_p18 101.3 0821_rental_1280_02_103

I feel 叶実 starting this line with だって feels a bit “off”, so I like the change to her saying どうしょう again. An early sentence 「あれは」 was traded in for a late sentence 「もの」 to refer to the frisbee.

101.4 64992928_p18 101.4 0821_rental_1280_02_103

This line was completely rewritten. Originally, Kanami is thinking she can’t look at Daigo’s face.

Pixv:「大吾おにいちゃんの顔見れないーーー」
Comm:「失敗する子供を嫌っちゃうーーー」

Page 104 Changes

104.1 64992928_p21 104.1 0821_rental_1280_02_106

Another removal of フリスビー. That’ll show 'em.

Page 107 Changes

107.1 64992928_p24 107.1 0821_rental_1280_02_109

The artwork for this panel was replaced with a piece from earlier in the chapter.

Page 110 Changes

110.1 64992928_p26 110.1 0821_rental_1280_02_112

The 俺 was removed from 慎’s dialogue here.

Page 112 Changes

112.1 64992928_p28 112.1 0821_rental_1280_02_114

みすず’s line ending changed from 「あってねー」 to 「あったんだ」. A side comment, 「意外かな?」 was also added.

Page 113 Changes

113.1 64992928_p29 113.1 0821_rental_1280_02_115

The furigana 「ここ」was added to 「優しい世界」. In case you were wondering where this place was referring to.

Bonus Artwork

(This was originally chapter 4, before other chapters were written that take place before.)

2 Likes

Things are getting really interesting here!! What will Misuzu say? A significant cliffhanger there… :thinking:

The reading for me was pretty good this week! However, I still have some doubts I´ve been taking note of:

Page 117

誰とだって笑い合えるから

This is more about the exact nuance of this だって here. I´ve read that it has a number of different uses (quoting, giving reasons, etc.) but one of them is also to give emphasis to what´s preceding it. Is it this case in particular here, as in emphasizing that with a smile he´ll be able to talk [even] to anyone (as in, no matter who he meets)?

Page 124

みすずちゃんも幼馴染みだからって構わなきゃいいのにね

I´m assuming that this is another variation of the common なくてはいけない in contracted form with the いい (which I had never seen combined with this なきゃ before, by the way) but, for some reason, I´m struggling to get a proper translation, especially because from context I expected that いい to be a よくない (Since what´s apparently happening is that the girl is saying that since Misuzu is Makoto´s childhood friend, he should care about her, not ignore her. I also came up with the possibility of using 構う in its second Jisho meaning of “to be a problem”, “to cause inconvenience”, thus thinking of a translation along the lines of “That (Misuzu trying to talk to him) shouldn´t be a problem”, but then there would be a change of subject) As you can see, my head is going bonkers here!

In addition, is that って there quoting as in saying: "Since I´ve heard that/ It seems to be that…?

Many thanks in advance!! :pray:

1 Like

I’d agree with your interpretation here.

なきゃ is a contraction of なければ, which frequently has an implied いけない (usually when it stands alone), but I wouldn’t say that implication is present here (because the conditional is immediately followed by いい). I’d actually split up the above sentence into two separate ones: 「みすずちゃんも幼馴染みだからって」and「構わなきゃいいのにね」. The first sentence is noting that the girl speaking heard/is quoting Misuzu’s status as a childhood friend of his, and I think this is meant as an explanatory note for her (Misuzu’s) actions in approaching Makoto.. I do think the って here is the quoting one. The second sentence is then following up with “even though it’d be good if she didn’t care”.

3 Likes

Page 124

Although not nearly as common (from what I’ve seen), you’ll find that なきゃ+いい does come up from time to time. Here’s from another manga I’m reading (with いい written as いー):

08_846731_846647_1_010_001x

It’s a really difficult one, isn’t it? The things kids say…

As @BarelyFragile said, なきゃ is contracted from なければ. And なければ is the conditional form of ない, so it’s a negative conditional. Here’s what I got from it:

  • かまう (to be concerned about [him])
  • かまわない (to not be concerned about [him])
  • かまわなければ (if to not be concerned about [him])
  • かまわなければいいだ (if to not be concerned about [him], it is good => “It’s fine to not be concerned about [him].”)

Finally, we add the のに at the end for, “Even though it’s fine not to be concerned about [him].”

Pronouns would be nice to have here. While the topic and subject are not always the same, when the topic is given, and no subject is given, and the subject is not clear from context, sometimes (sometimes) one can infer the subject to be the same as the topic. Thus with Misuzu as the topic, I’ve taken her to be the subject as well.

Note that there’s the aside text on the girl’s word balloon with the 「帰ろ 帰ろ」. I think she’s repeating what Misuzu said to Makoto, and I take the repetition to suggest Misuzu invites Makoto to walk home with her from time to time. “Even though it’s fine if she isn’t concerned with him… Let’s go home, let’s go home.” Or if we want the “even though” to be at the end like のに is, “It’s fine if she isn’t concerned with him, and yet… Let’s go home, let’s go home.”

To connect this with the first half… I sometimes have trouble with the inclusive topic marker も. I’m guessing this みすずも is to mean “Misuzu is (as well as Makoto)”, and the おさななじみ means she’s also a childhood friend, meaning she and Makoto are childhood friends. Maybe I’m wrong, but at the very least I read this portion sort of like “Misuzu is also childhood friends (with Makoto).”

Between the two parts of the sentence is だからって, which ichi.moe tells me is used like an expression to mean “even so; all the same; nevertheless; yes, but …”

Altogether I get (with some Englishizing), “Misuzu may be childhood friends with him, but all the same, it’s fine if she doesn’t concern herself with him, and yet… Let’s go home, let’s go home.”

4 Likes

Ahh I was obsessed with the fact that なきゃ had to go with いけない no matter what! Great to see another construction!

I completely forgot about that のに as “even though”, I was taking it to be a mere emotion expression that followed the いい! It´s a tricky thing this particle.

Such a useful info, many thanks!! :smile: :spiral_notepad: (Also for all the breakdown and explanation; this gratitude goes also to @BarelyFragile)

2 Likes

Changes from Pixiv Original to Commercial Release

This post covers changes in the first third of chapter 9, as it went from original Pixiv release to commercial release. This is the first Pixiv chapter to make use of school uniforms.

Pixiv Chapter Cover Image

This chapter was originally chapter 5.

Page 117

65752898_p2.1 0821_rental_1280_02_119.1

Daigo’s monologue originally included 「一緒に」. I suppose this is sort of implied by the 合える, so that may be why it was removed.

65752898_p2.2 0821_rental_1280_02_119.2

Daigo’s thought originally ended in 「暗い目」.

Page 118

65752898_p3 0821_rental_1280_02_120

The second dialogue balloon’s contents changed quite a bit:

Pixv:「放っておいても・・いいと思うぜ」
Comm:「町谷も関わらなくていいと思うよ」

Page 119

The second half of Daigo’s monologue was changed a little:

Pixv:「あんな目のままずっとひとりでおるんか…?」
Comm:「・・・あのまま・ずっとひとりでおるんか…?」

(Also, did Makoto shrink just a bit?)

65752898_p4.2 0821_rental_1280_02_121.2

Daigo’s thought opening changed from 「こんなん」 to 「そんなん」.

Page 120

Originally, either Daigo stood up from his chair in a quick manner that the chair made a sound as it hit the ground, or Daigo slammed his hands onto the desk. I’m guessing the former.

For dialogue, Daigo’s line was slightly reworded:

Pixv:「俺はお前と友達になってみせる!
Comm:「俺・・・友達になってくれへん!?

Page 121

65752898_p6 0821_rental_1280_02_123

Originally, the boy speaking says 「放っておけって」, reminding that he said (on page 118) that Daigo doesn’t need to bother with Makoto. Since that line was changed, this one was as well. Now his line reads 「放っておけよ」.

2 Likes

Week 8: Pages 127–140

Start Date: 2021-01-08T15:00:00Z

Vocabulary List

Page Numbers Guide (thumbnail spoilers)

Participation

Mark your participation status by voting in this poll.
(You can change your answer later if you’d like.)

  • I’m reading along.
  • I have finished this part.

0 voters

Volume 3 Prep

Considering volume 3, we can continue splitting a chapter across two weeks, or speed it it up to one chapter per week. The difficultly level of volume 3 is about on par with volume 2 up to this point. How are you feeling about the reading pace, for volume 3? This poll is anonymous.

  • I prefer chapters continue to split over two weeks.
  • I don’t mind whether a chapter is read in one week or two.
  • I’m not planning on reading volume 3.

0 voters

3 Likes

Wow, I think for me that was by far the most dense week until now! Lot´s of text and different grammar, but I think I coped up quite well. I do have several questions, though :pray: :smile:

Page 128

今の真は仕方ないとこもあるんだ

I´m unsure about the grammar beneath that とこ. I´m assuming it´s a casual contraction of ところ, and I´ve read in Maggie Sensei that ところ plus plain form had the nuance of "about to do / not do something, but is that the case here? As in:

This Makoto is about to turn into a hopeless case

Page 133

さっきはなんも知らん怒ってほんまごめん

I get what he´s saying, but I´m lost with that と. Is it the conditional one?

Page 134

This is the tremendous page. :joy: :exploding_head: But I loved it because it´s pushing me to the limit.

Upper panels

Right

友達できても離れての繰り返しで

First time I´ve seen that ての, which I assumed was a nominalization of the て form, but anybody can shed some light on the precise grammar? I got something like:

Even though I was able to make friends, there was the repetition of having to separate (?)

Left (and central right bubble)

仲良くなっても無駄じゃ…って落ち込んでた時に母さんから言われてん, 自分から周りを笑顔にしていき

The big one. First I want to check my translation with you guys to see if I more or less got it. I read:

At the times when I felt sad thinking that even though I made friends, it was useless, my mother didn´t tell me that, [instead she said]: “Start smiling yourself to everyone around you and…” (What follows I have no problems with)

However. what´s that していき and the end? I assume it comes from ていく, but why is that ます form there clinging at the end? Does it act like a て form connector?

Many thanks in advance!!

1 Like

Page 128

My (still limited) understanding of ところ is that while it can be a physical location, it can also be a non-physical location.

Imagine you’re with a friend who gets angry at something, and you tell them “find your happy place.” You’re not telling them to go to a physical location where they will be happy, but rather a state of mind.

In Misuzu’s dialogue here, I think you more or less have it right, about Makoto being in a place where he cannot be helped. I don’t think there’s a nuance of “about to do” in this, but I could be wrong.

Page 133

It is indeed.

This one’s a bit tricky, because the last verb is in the て form. We don’t know if it’s present or past tense. Since Daigo is apologizing for his past behavior, I’d say past tense makes sense. Perhaps something like, “When I didn’t know anything, I got angry.” But in English I might translate this as “since” or “because”.

Page 134

I believe you have to right, that it’s making 「離れて」 into a noun. This lets it modify 繰り返し.

Keep in mind, the で at the end is just the て form of だ. It’s not part of 繰り返し. This 繰り返し is a noun, so we have:

“Verb in て form” + の + “noun”

According to someone on the Internet:

In this case, the action of 離れて (being separated) results in 繰り返し (repetition, of making friends). I don’t know how to express this directly in English (by way of Japanese grammar), but if I reword it a little, I’d maybe go with, “Even if I could make friends, I’d repeatedly be separated from them.” Or maybe it’s more like, “Even if I could make friends, it’d be repeatedly because I’d be separated from them.” (I think that one’s probably worse.)

(I’m trusting that someone on the Internet is correct and knows more than I do. I think that’s a safe bet.)

Without delving too deeply into comparing the Japanese and English (I’m running low on time), it sounds about right to me.

You’re right about the ていく. We have 「笑顔にする+いく」, using the て form to join them.

As for いき, it does work much like て. In fact, 行き is basically the て form without the て.

It’s hard to imagine this with 行く since it becomes 行って, but consider 出す: it becomes 出して, and without the て you get 出し.

This form is used similar to the て form, but where て often has a feel of “verbing and …”, without て you get more a feel of “to verb and …”

For fun, some grammar terms

The verb form ending in a sound from the い-row (of the hiragana chart) is called 連用形, which essentially means “continuous use form”. It is used to attach either て, or た (complete, past tense form), or ます (for politeness).

When you don’t attach anything to it, it’s called 中止法. (Do you remember 中止 from WK level 3? Or has it been burned and then since forgotten? And 法 is WK level 15.)

Don’t worry, this part won’t be on the test.

There’s a reason this chapter’s split into three weeks =D

Details on splitting chapters over weeks.

For this volume, I wanted to try and even out the pages as much as possible, so I made color-coded copies of the pages based on weight of text:

  • red = heavy on text
  • blue = normal
  • green = light on text
  • gray = little to no text

Here’s how chapter 9 came out as a three-week split:

2 Likes

Ahh, I had also completely forgotten that the と conditional could also mean “when” if it referred to the past, just like in this case!

Maybe less stylish but greatly instructive haha!! :smile: I got the structure meaning much better with this one. I´m not sure how common this pattern may be, but it seems I have to add just another “causal-condition” structure to my brain :exploding_head: Having said that, why the author chose to use this pattern or, in other words, when one has to use this “Verb in て form” + の + “noun” still is obscure to me. But I prefer to think that this may be an advanced grammar which I just need to retain in terms, as you said (and the internet) of “condition-cause — result (noun)”. Many thanks!

I´ll let this difference sink in my “advanced-future-still to work more on grammar”, because the nuance seems to be something to get used to. I´ve also found, thanks to your explanation and wonderful grammar details, that in Imabi there is a specific entry on this topic and the differences with the て form:

https://www.imabi.net/renyouchuushikei.htm (Maybe you already knew it)

Overall, many many thanks for all your breakdowns and explanations, they were spot on, as always!! :pray: :spiral_notepad:

2 Likes

とこ is indeed one of those tricky words that has way too many uses. My interpretation is that this particular case is using meaning 5 in jisho, where とこ means “aspect, side, facet”.

After Misuzu explains what’s going on with Makoto, she says “Currently Makoto has a part of him that cannot be helped.”. She’s saying that given his circumstances, it’s no wonder that Makoto behaves and feels the way he currently does, and that nothing can be done about this.

I agree with Cristopher in that this とこ isn’t being used in the “about to do” sense. Keep in mind that for とこ to mean that, it needs to follow a verb. From bunpro:

In our current sentence, it’s following the i-adjective 仕方ない

2 Likes

Many thanks for your info!! :pray:

1 Like

Week 9: Pages 141–156

Start Date: 2021-01-15T15:00:00Z

x0821_rental_1280_02_143

Vocabulary List

Page Numbers Guide (thumbnail spoilers)

Participation

Mark your participation status by voting in this poll.
(You can change your answer later if you’d like.)

  • I’m reading along.
  • I have finished this part.

0 voters

(I’ll post a Pixiv/commercial comparison of last week’s material later.)

2 Likes

That was quite an unexpected part 3 for this chapter… really enjoying that we are getting to know more facets of our protagonists.

2 Likes