なぜ?どうして?Currently reading pages 121 to 124


#2406

Page 104 - looking tricky! I’ll kick us off with first sentence:

この 人たちは、たとえ かみの毛でも 体の 一部なのだから、ぜったい きずつけては いけないと いう 考えを もっています。

この 人たちは、Speaking of these people

たとえ even if…is the case (with …でも)

かみの毛 hair

でも (end of たとえ…ても construction)

体の of the body/body’s

一部 one part, one portion

なの explanatory particle

だから、therefore

ぜったい absolutely

きずつけてはいけない must not damage

と いう is said

考えを thought plus を

もっています is holding

Maybe:
These people therefore, hold the idea, that even the hair is one part of the body, and absolutely they must not damage it.

Not sure I’ve got the second clause right. Here are the references for たとえ…ても

https://japanese.upstory.biz/archives/3547

And


#2407

Page 104

Thank you Micki! I’ll try the second sentence. Any takers for the third and fourth?

切らずに ずっと のばして 長くなった かみは, ふくざつに あんだ たばのように なり, まるで 太い ロープのように 見えます

切らずに - without cutting (ず form, as seen on the previous page too)
ずっと - for a long time
のばして - 伸ばす, to grow long, in てform (“and”)
長くなった - become long
かみ - hair
は, - topic marker, ie everything before this marks the topic: “hair which is not cut for a long time and grows long”

ふくざつに - 複雑, complex, complicated, intricate + に
あんだ - 編む, to knit; to plait; to braid, in plain past tense (why in plain past tense?)
たば - 束, bunch
のように - like a (bunch)
なり, - become
まるで - like, as if
太い ロープのように - like a think rope
見えます - look like

“Hair which is not cut for a long time and which grows long becomes intricately knitted together in something like a bunch, and looks like a thick rope”


#2408

Thanks that’s a really helpful breakdown. Perhaps the plain past tense indicates that the whole phrase “ふくざつに あんだ” modifies たび to be “a complex knitted bundle”.


#2409

Yeah, it’s a mammoth post by Maggie! Sorry, should’ve pointed you to the right place - not sure how to do it via hyperlink (old and decrepit here).

If I’m right, it would be interesting to find out how the “verbal agreement” version would be written. I’m guessing it would involve a で particle, something along the lines of というで maybe?


#2410

Third sentence:

これは ジャマイカの 一部の 人たちに よく 見らせる かみがたです。

This is a commonly-seen hairstyle among parts of the Jamaican people.

(Since the fourth sentence also comprises about half the text on the next page, one wonders if maybe we should leave it for tomorrow.)


#2411

Page 104 last sentence

ジャマイカと いえば、元りく上たんきょりせん手の ウサイン•ボルトさんや、音楽家の ボブ•マーリーさんが 有名です。

Jamaica is famous for people like the former short distance track and field athlete Usain Bolt and the musician Bob Marley.

EDIT - or could it be:

Speaking of Jamaica, people like the former short distance track and field athlete Usain Bolt and the musician Bob Marley are famous.


#2412

Page 105:

I read today’s page and I think I understood most of it, but I don’t have time to post any translation. Waiting for you guys :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:


#2413

Page 105 - a gentle page after yesterday!

マーリーさんも このような 考え方から 髪の毛を 長く のばしていました。

Bob Marley also grew his hair long, following this way of thinking.

ジャマイカに ある ボブ•マーリーさん (1945-1981) の ぞう。

Statue of Bob Marley in Jamaica.


#2414

I thought we were already in the next chapter :man_facepalming:t2:


#2415

Thank you for this translation! Was having a really hard time knowing where to separate things here.


#2416

I personally would go with your second translation even though it sounds a little awkward by itself. According to DOJG, when といえば is used, it makes a topic of something that was previously mentioned, so in this case it connects the sentence to “Jamaica”.

So I think this sentence has to be translated and read in context of the previous sentence even though it doesn’t sound quite as smooth as your first translation.

An example from DOJG:

A: 次の日曜日は京都へ行くつもりだ。
A: I’m going to Kyoto next Sunday.

B: 京都と言えば、春子が京都大学試験に通ったそうだ。
B: Speaking of Kyoto, I heard that Haruko passed Kyoto University’s entrance exam.

Edit: Just wanted to share another angle on this たとえ~でも/ても thing. Kanzen Master says it “Means that even if a certain fact or state exists, something will take place or be done regardless.”
(Just another idea to confuse things a little.:wink:)


#2417

Wow, you caught up, That’s fantastic!


#2418

I know, thank you! Took forever…


#2419

No you just crossed the date line on the way to Hawaii!


#2420

I’m not yet there! I’m going tomorrow, and actually I’ going back on time, not forward :wink:


#2421

Page 104

元りく上たんきょりせん手

I’d add my voice to @icenando’s and thank you for your translation @Micki, because I’d never have understood this without you!

元りく上たんきょりせん手

元 - former; ex-; past; one-time​
りく上 - 陸上, track-and-field events
たん -
きょり - 距離, distance; range
せん手 - 選手, player (sports); athlete; team member

The only thing I can’t find is that たん, any pointers anyone?


#2422

Someone had added it to the vocab list as 元陸上短距離選手, so I guess that たん is where the “short” part comes in. Jisho also has the word 短距離たんきょり (short distance).


#2423

Oh that is great! Thank you so much Saruko!


#2424

Page 106

すまい: どろで つくられた、大きな たてものが ある!

Dwelling: There is a huge building made of mud!

日本には 木で できた たてものが たくさん ありますが、せかいには、石で できた たてものも 多く 見られます。

In Japan there are lots of buildings made of wood, but in the world there are also lots of buildings made or stone to be seen.

いっぽう、アフリカの 国、マリには ちょっと かわった もので できた たてものが あります。

On the other hand, in Mali, an African country, there are buildings made of something a little different.


#2425

Page 107

It’s not midnight yet, but I haven’t done all this hard work just to be pipped at the post, … so here goes…… (sorry Micki!)!

Sentence 1 :
モスク (イスラム教の おいのりを する たてもの) なのですが, なんと どろで できているのです

モスク - mosque
イスラム教の - Islamic…
お - honorific prefix
いのりを - prayer + を (direct object particle)
する - to do
たてもの - building
なの - explanation particle (and preceding な)
です - is this a です (polite copula) in the middle of a sentence?
が, - but
なんと - what; how; whatever​
どろで - 泥で, of/with mud
できている - 出来る, to be made, in ている form
の - explanation particle
です - polite ending

“It is a mosque (a building for Islamic prayer) but surprisingly it is made of mud”.

Question: I’m a bit confused by the です in the middle, but I suspect it has something to do with the fact it comes after の. Any ideas?

Sentence 2 :

マリの ジェンネは, 広大な サハラ砂漠に ある ふるい 町です

マリの ジェンネは, - Djenné in Mali + は
広大な - vast; extensive; immense (な-adjective)
サハラ砂漠に - Sahara Desert​ + に, in
ある - there is
ふるい - 古い, old
町 - town
です - polite copula

“Djenné in Mali is an old town in the vast Sahara Desert”.

Question: I don’t understand why ある is in the middle of the sentence rather than at the end. Any ideas?

Sentence 3 :

この 町の 中心に たつ モスクは, どろを かためて つくられ,「どろのモスク」として 有名です

この 町の 中心に - in the centre of this town
たつ - 立つ, to stand (or possibly 建つ, to be erected, to be built?)
モスクは, mosque + は
どろを mud + を
かためて - 固める, to harden, in てform
つくられ, - 作る, to make, in passive form (not too sure about this)
「どろのモスク」- mud mosque
として - as
有名 - famous
です - polite copula

“In the centre of this town stands [a building] made of hardened mud, famous as the “Mud Mosque””.

Question: What is the grammar in つくられ? The full passive is 作られる, but here the final る has been dropped. Is it acting like a connective て form?

Sentence 4 :

この モスクは とても きみょうな 形を しています

この モスクは - this mosque
とても - very
きみょうな - 奇妙, strange (な-adjective)
形を - shape + を
しています - has

“This mosque has a very strange shape”.

Question: しています literally means “is doing”, right? I don’t think I’ve ever seen it used as “has” before (though with my memory, anything is possible!). Is this a common pattern?

Thank you everyone!